The more time that goes by, the more I want this dude to start at SG for us
Our team's calling card come playoffs will be defense. But this isn't the NFL, offense >>>> defense in the NBA. So I love the idea of Murray, who will improve our defense, adds another ball handler, and adds offense
I think I want Murray more than Mitchell. I think the former would fit in. I think the latter might disrupt the fabric of the team, because he'd arguably be a bigger star than Brunson and Randle
nycericanguy wrote:newyorknewyork wrote:nycericanguy wrote:newyorknewyork wrote:nycericanguy wrote:people say this guy can't shoot...lol. And legit compare him to RJ?... RJ could never take and make this shot... he shot 34% from 3 and that was almost all spoonfed wide open 3's.
who on our team even has the ability to even get that shot off, let alone drill it like that? Brunson...that's it.
There's a huge difference between shooting 38% on open C&S 3's like Grimes does, vs 39% on the type of unassisted 3's DJM takes.
It's not an aberration, DJM has been improving from 3 for 4 years, it's time people accept that he can flat shoot now.
Not saying it won't work or that it will work. Just things that need to be taken into account. Like his role here will be different here than his role with the Spurs and the Hawks. There is no Randle esq player on the Hawks commanding 20 shot attempts having Murray compete with for the 2nd option.
His role here would be to guard the tougher opponent between the PG/SG. Provide necessary spacing for Brunson & Randle to operate. Cover Brunson's creation ability as he gets his rest. Be the leader of the 2nd unit with DDV, Hart,(Mitch).
If he is willing to defer to Randle and accept these responsibilities. The fit has potential to work since he is capable of doing those things asked. The true wild card is how this affects the key role players DDV & Hart. A Murray, DDV, Hart, OG, Mitch 2nd unit could do work for a defensive fastbreak unit in a best case scenario though.
we had RJ here and he got his 15-16 shots and scored 20 without a problem starting along those two. DDV has scored 13ppg in 23mpg as a starter... that's over 20ppg PER 36. IQ scored 15 without any issues.
The shots are there. Randle and Brunson along with the starters have had to play big minutes since the trade b/c we dont have anyone else that can create and score... so DJM is much more of a solution than a problem.
Thibs plays his starters big mins. Thats how he has always coached. Murray will get 33mins per at minimum with the high probability of playing even more if Thibs falls in love.
Don't get hung up on shot attempts to what I was saying. It's more about role. Murray was the #1 on the Spurs and now #2 on ATL. He will be #3 with the Knicks. The #3 is asked to do things that u want to limit your #1 & #2 from doing. He's gonna have to accept taking on the tougher defensive assignment while Brunson still gets first offensively. There are gonna be many possessions when he is left out while Brunson and Randle run a 2 man game. Hes gonna need to be willing to accept that and still dig in on defense. Have the feel to know when to pick his spots within this role. And faith that his time will come to get his up with that 2nd unit.
Knicks will be paying a real good price with the hopes that he conforms to an elite 3rd option doing all the things mentioned above.
Knicks only have 3 players in the top 100 in MPG... that's a very old narrative about Thibs overplaying guys. Even this year we dont have a single player in the top 10 in MPG and that's despite Brunson and Randle's minutes having gone way up since the trade. No one gets on Joe Mazulla for playing Tatum 36mpg, that's strictly a NY obsession with Thibs. Young stars play 35-36mpg, there's nothing crazy about that.
There are plenty of shots and minutes for DJM here no matter how you slice it. These guys don't get labeled "1,2 and 3". There will be plenty of nights when DJM is the #1 and #2...
There will be plenty of mins for Murray because Thibs is gonna play him 33-35mins almost guaranteed. Especially if hes as good as your championing him to be. Grimes as strictly 3&D role player got 30mins per game as a starter to Quickly's 24mins off the bench. And IQ was better than Grimes. Brunson got 35mins as a starter even with a player like IQ behind him. Thibs could of easily dropped Brunson to 32mins and Grimes to 28 and got IQ to 30 etc. That's not how Thibs does things. The players whose mins will be effected by Murray will more so be DDV and Hart. Shots also won't be a problem for Murray, never argued that. The players affected by shots would be OG, Hartenstien, DDV, Hart, Mitch when he comes back.
None of that is even what I'm stating though. The reason why we were able to lose the production of RJ and IQ and yet improve is OGs ability and willingness to accept his role and responsibilities. As well as Brunson and Randle being able to increase production and efficiency with higher workload. OG has no problems taking on ALL the defensive assignments and taking the left over kick outs and back door cuts. The hope is the Murray comes in with a similar mindset when playing alongside of Brunson and Randle. And then he will get his chance to be featured when they rest.
Again to be clear I'm not saying that it's not going to work. I'm stating what needs to happen for it to work to reach the level of success we are hoping for..
I think OG and our shooters in general would benefit from DJM too, DJM's last full season as a PG he had an assist rate over 40%!, that's borderline CP3 numbers. He's a better playmaker than Brunson who tends to attack with his head down.
Imagine a lineup with DJM running PG surrounded by shooters? Brunson has turned into one of the best shooters in the NBA, him playing SG for stretches isn't a bad thing, it's a great thing for spacing.
And would be even more ideal if Murray utilized being the feature of the 2nd unit to create shots for everyone else as that type of PG. Then we might even be a championship contender.
Murray and Hart can both rebound a run.
newyorknewyork wrote:And would be even more ideal if Murray utilized being the feature of the 2nd unit to create shots for everyone else as that type of PG. Then we might even be a championship contender.
i'm sure that would be the plan, take over that 2nd quarter RJ role.
nycericanguy wrote:I think OG and our shooters in general would benefit from DJM too, DJM's last full season as a PG he had an assist rate over 40%!, that's borderline CP3 numbers. He's a better playmaker than Brunson who tends to attack with his head down.Imagine a lineup with DJM running PG surrounded by shooters? Brunson has turned into one of the best shooters in the NBA, him playing SG for stretches isn't a bad thing, it's a great thing for spacing.
This is everything Dejounte distilled down to the crux of it IMHO
I don’t believe this rumor at all. Just fluff to get Atlanta moving
I believe it. It's Danny Ainge. One of the biggest DBs in the league.
Come on Landry!! Do us a solid and pull off the trade KG to your friends in Boston! Follow the plan!!
Garrett2010PSD wrote:I believe it. It's Danny Ainge. One of the biggest DBs in the league.
It’s not that Ainge isn’t a dbag that we don’t believe, it’s that the Knicks want Clarkson’s 23mm contract this year, going into two more years at 14mm each. For Clarkson. They can do better.
martin wrote:nycericanguy wrote:I think OG and our shooters in general would benefit from DJM too, DJM's last full season as a PG he had an assist rate over 40%!, that's borderline CP3 numbers. He's a better playmaker than Brunson who tends to attack with his head down.Imagine a lineup with DJM running PG surrounded by shooters? Brunson has turned into one of the best shooters in the NBA, him playing SG for stretches isn't a bad thing, it's a great thing for spacing.
This is everything Dejounte distilled down to the crux of it IMHO
I’d pull the trigger on Murray and see what happens next. I know guys don’t like Bey on this board, but I would love to add Bet to the mix also. Another Wildcat.
nycericanguy wrote:I think OG and our shooters in general would benefit from DJM too, DJM's last full season as a PG he had an assist rate over 40%!, that's borderline CP3 numbers. He's a better playmaker than Brunson who tends to attack with his head down.Imagine a lineup with DJM running PG surrounded by shooters? Brunson has turned into one of the best shooters in the NBA, him playing SG for stretches isn't a bad thing, it's a great thing for spacing.
Atlanta redditors are saying Dejounte isn't as good on corner kickouts. Also, his man defense isn't really good. I think this board is mixing the idealized version of DJM with the reality.
BigDaddyG wrote:nycericanguy wrote:I think OG and our shooters in general would benefit from DJM too, DJM's last full season as a PG he had an assist rate over 40%!, that's borderline CP3 numbers. He's a better playmaker than Brunson who tends to attack with his head down.Imagine a lineup with DJM running PG surrounded by shooters? Brunson has turned into one of the best shooters in the NBA, him playing SG for stretches isn't a bad thing, it's a great thing for spacing.
Atlanta redditors are saying Dejounte isn't as good on corner kickouts. Also, his man defense isn't really good. I think this board is mixing the idealized version of DJM with the reality.
The sell on Dejounte while with SA and before Atlanta was that he was a very good defender. But he was never OG or even Grimes as a POA defender. He is a disrupt-er type defender off the ball, just like DDV or IQ. He can be a secondary POA defender though, just not the main guys. Put him in the correct defensive role, and voila, he is a much better defender. Atlanta forces him to be a POA defender because of Trae.
nycericanguy wrote:I think OG and our shooters in general would benefit from DJM too, DJM's last full season as a PG he had an assist rate over 40%!, that's borderline CP3 numbers. He's a better playmaker than Brunson who tends to attack with his head down.Imagine a lineup with DJM running PG surrounded by shooters? Brunson has turned into one of the best shooters in the NBA, him playing SG for stretches isn't a bad thing, it's a great thing for spacing.
Shooters we don't have many. Randle and Hartenstein aren't strong outside shooters. Hart also isn't a strong outside shooter from the bench as he doesn't look to attempt much. Mitch if on the roster he doesn't provide any.
2nd unit based off personnel would be more about pushing the pace. Murray and Hart are both very strong rebounders at G&F. They both can grab and go attacking in transition with DDV & OG running to their corner spots in case of kickouts. Precious/Mitch/Big traded for, can cover as a trailer.
Mitch back in the rotation would force to shift the 2nd unit to more of a defensive first, transition team off stls and rebs.
BigDaddyG wrote:nycericanguy wrote:I think OG and our shooters in general would benefit from DJM too, DJM's last full season as a PG he had an assist rate over 40%!, that's borderline CP3 numbers. He's a better playmaker than Brunson who tends to attack with his head down.Imagine a lineup with DJM running PG surrounded by shooters? Brunson has turned into one of the best shooters in the NBA, him playing SG for stretches isn't a bad thing, it's a great thing for spacing.
Atlanta redditors are saying Dejounte isn't as good on corner kickouts. Also, his man defense isn't really good. I think this board is mixing the idealized version of DJM with the reality.
I think DJM becomes the primary ball handler in NY. Randle is first look. Brunson is the finisher. Baby steps to becoming a better team.
"I'm a dog…I can do just about whatever [Thibs] needs…I play extremely hard…both ends…type of player he likes…Every time we play Thibs I go up & shake his hand b/c of what he's done…Nothing but respect…I love New York"
–– Bruce Brown
More: nypost.com/2024/01/21/spo…
Looks like Brown will be the Knicks target.
Rookie wrote:Garrett2010PSD wrote:"I'm a dog…I can do just about whatever [Thibs] needs…I play extremely hard…both ends…type of player he likes…Every time we play Thibs I go up & shake his hand b/c of what he's done…Nothing but respect…I love New York" –– Bruce Brown
More: nypost.com/2024/01/21/spo…
Looks like Brown will be the Knicks target.
Is Brown 22M good?
It's not what I would do. I would trade for a backup PG and wait until after the season to make a big move.
Things change quickly this time of year. I’m sure the Knicks are monitoring many players as the deadline approaches. But at the moment, Brown and Burks are two players squarely on New York’s radar.
https://www.sny.tv/articles/just-another-day-office-knicks-jalen-brunson-julius-randle
This regime is very tightlipped, I dont think anyone knows what they're doing. OG was speculated because it made a ton of sense and he switched to CAA. but even that trade dropped out of nowhere with no leaks beforehand.
