So bear with me on this one. A lot of Paul George talk. If he opts into his final year of his contract and wants a trade to the Knicks, here how it would go down;
Knicks and clippers really can’t do a 2 team trade. Knicks can’t take in more salary than they send out or they are hard capped at the first apron. I’m guessing they don’t want to do that and it would make it difficult to make other moves. Clippers at the second apron and really can’t do anything. They must send out more salary than they take in, and by a sizable amount so they can get under the second apron at least temporarily to resign harden in the instance of a PG trade.
Knicks would essentially send Randle to LA and PG comes back to the Knicks. Additional draft compensation to the clippers as needed. Clippers save a bunch of money to retain some flexibility under the second apron and don’t have to aggregate players. Knicks will then send additional salary to a third team to meet salary cap requirements and avoid being being hard capped. Mitch, Jeffries and Diakite fits the requirements of them sending out more money, but there’s another weird rule where you can’t send out multiple minimum contracts in a deal where 3 or more players go out for a single player. so this would be against the rules. So now it’s essentially bogey and 1 minimum guy to a third team, or 2 out of the 3 of Bogey, Mitch and Deuce. Any of those combinations to a third team satisfies Paul George trade requirements for all teams as long as the additional players sent to a third team are eaten into cap space (although the more salary the Knicks send out, means they can get something back as long as they are sending out more than they are taking back.)
Now let’s just say the Knicks send bogey and a minimum guy to a third team. They’ve avoided being hard capped at the first apron and are only hard capped at the second apron due to aggregating salaries. They are still eligible to resign Achiuwa and/or use the tax paying MLE depending on how the numbers shake out. When Dec 15 comes around and the Nets still realize they suck, maybe the Knicks can send Mitch, Deuce and another 4M in salary (taxpayers MLE guy, Achiuwa or drafted players, whatever combination gets us there) plus every draft pick under the sun for Mikal Bridges.
So there’s a world where the Knicks could field a lineup of Brunson, Bridges, PG, OG and Hartenstein with Donte, Hart, and Achiuwa or a taxpayer MLE big man off the bench and still be below the second apron for this upcoming season.
This is the pie in the sky possibility. There’s many other scenarios I’m sure the Knicks have concepts for. The new rules are complicated but there’s loopholes for everything. Do I expect this to happen? No, but I can dream.
There is one more outside possibility that the Knicks can send Randle to the clippers and only mitch to a third team and they can waive bogey and hard hard cap themselves at the first apron. They would probably be below even resigning Hartenstein and OG but then they are pretty limited on how they would fill out the roster. Can’t rule it out them being ok being hard capped at the first apron for a year, but it pretty much eliminates any follow up ways to improve the roster for a year.
Im just hung up on paying a dude soon to be 35 who had a good season in a sort of contract year/extension leverage.
This guy got his money, got traded to his home town and worked for a man who has a ton of money and has been very generous.
Clippers not exactly live up to expectations. I think PG13 and Klay Thompson deserve a certain financial consideration based on market conditions but a little gratitude as well? Maybe a compromise for good will from both sides?
Klay sat for two full seasons and 50 of another on a big contract. I get teams are ready to move on and Klay might not be a good fit anymore. I hope its not about money, but about playing time and a role. If Klay does move on I hope he clarifies his position and desire to keep playing. If its about money and respect, well it will speak for itself.
As for knicks, PG might be a good fit but on a two year deal. Really, if he plays well I don't mind incentive laden deal that compensates him as such. Few players defy Father Time and live up to big contracts. Kareem, Malone (Moses and Karl!), and of course Lebron among others have. Dudes like Chris Paul have not. Long list of players not up to their deal. Fault the team as player is stupid to turn down the money. But the player can also be gracious at the same time. I'd respect the shit out of PG13 if he went to Philly for a big two year deal. He wants a chip? OK. If that can't be done in LA with Clips, thats ok too.
For that matter, wouldn't Harden be a good fit back in Philly?? That would be a hoot after all was said.
Yeah I know, “trade Randle….”
I understand the talent of Paul George and the “quirks” of Julius Randle. And I understand this isn’t a dump Randle thread. Seems to me Paul George has chinks in his armor as well and Randle has a little bit of talent? But that’s not my main point - that would be that the success of the current team is based on not doing what they always did. The “get a star” narrative will be out there until the team wins it all. But giving up many assets to bring in a 34 year old with an injury history to eat up the cap is the same old same old.
And I say we already have our stars, Julius included.
I would S&T OG for Paul George maybe- but not likely. I was surprised that PG managed to play 74 regular season games.
I would probably bet my house on that as an under for next year.
So - can’t have both PG and OG on the same team taking as much salary as they will.
Nalod wrote:Im just hung up on paying a dude soon to be 35 who had a good season in a sort of contract year/extension leverage.
This guy got his money, got traded to his home town and worked for a man who has a ton of money and has been very generous.
Clippers not exactly live up to expectations. I think PG13 and Klay Thompson deserve a certain financial consideration based on market conditions but a little gratitude as well? Maybe a compromise for good will from both sides?
Klay sat for two full seasons and 50 of another on a big contract. I get teams are ready to move on and Klay might not be a good fit anymore. I hope its not about money, but about playing time and a role. If Klay does move on I hope he clarifies his position and desire to keep playing. If its about money and respect, well it will speak for itself.As for knicks, PG might be a good fit but on a two year deal. Really, if he plays well I don't mind incentive laden deal that compensates him as such. Few players defy Father Time and live up to big contracts. Kareem, Malone (Moses and Karl!), and of course Lebron among others have. Dudes like Chris Paul have not. Long list of players not up to their deal. Fault the team as player is stupid to turn down the money. But the player can also be gracious at the same time. I'd respect the shit out of PG13 if he went to Philly for a big two year deal. He wants a chip? OK. If that can't be done in LA with Clips, thats ok too.
For that matter, wouldn't Harden be a good fit back in Philly?? That would be a hoot after all was said.
So let’s set the table correct.
PG just turned 34yo. And I’m assuming that if the Knicks traded for PG they would also have had a good enough chance to know the magnitude and details of the exact contract PG was looking for. Leverage eased enough?
If PG opts into his contract, he can be traded. My question is which years contract numbers are used?
Before or at time of draft, are all traded contracts counted as their season 2024-25 numbers?
And are the new aprons are already in effect or will they be in effect at time of draft or after draft when free agency opens? So, if you make a trade on draft day you don’t have to worry about apron trade rules but after draft you do?
Yes, PG turned 34 in May.
Just sounds so much better when we fluff the numbers!
"PG will be 35 if knicks repeat to advance to second round of playoffs!!!"
That colors him old.
Hey, never back down, right?
He played 74 games last year. Last time he played that much was 2018-19 when he played 77 games. He has not played over 60 since then. (Was the covid season to factor in).
Amazing when guys get geared up for a contract year or extension how they play up! Kawhi same thing. He played 68 games this year, most since the 2018-19 season by far!!!
Do we think a sign and trade for OG straight up is possible here? Not optimal but both teams get something where they might have a player walk??
A 35 year old George is not going to bring us closer to a championship. I wouldn't do it unless it's a dirt cheap trade (ie. Bogey, Burks, two 1sts).
martin wrote:If PG opts into his contract, he can be traded. My question is which years contract numbers are used?Before or at time of draft, are all traded contracts counted as their season 2024-25 numbers?
And are the new aprons are already in effect or will they be in effect at time of draft or after draft when free agency opens? So, if you make a trade on draft day you don’t have to worry about apron trade rules but after draft you do?
The number that’s used is his upcoming season. Goes for all players. Also the apron stuff is already in affect. Essentially the new league rules are already in use.
Also I’m not for or against a PG trade at this point. I’m really split right now and it would come down to a lot of factors like draft compensation and what comes next.
Nalod wrote:Yes, PG turned 34 in May.
Just sounds so much better when we fluff the numbers!"PG will be 35 if knicks repeat to advance to second round of playoffs!!!"
That colors him old.
Hey, never back down, right?
He played 74 games last year. Last time he played that much was 2018-19 when he played 77 games. He has not played over 60 since then. (Was the covid season to factor in).
Amazing when guys get geared up for a contract year or extension how they play up! Kawhi same thing. He played 68 games this year, most since the 2018-19 season by far!!!
Do we think a sign and trade for OG straight up is possible here? Not optimal but both teams get something where they might have a player walk??
You never trade a 23yo for a 37yo guy 😅
knixkik
Knicks would essentially send Randle to LA and PG comes back to the Knicks. Additional draft compensation to the clippers as needed.
Why are we including "additional draft compensation" when trading a younger All NBA player for an older one for double the money?
We're bailing them out and they get draft capital? How about the other way around for once? Why do we have to be the stooges?
martin wrote:Nalod wrote:Yes, PG turned 34 in May.
Just sounds so much better when we fluff the numbers!;PG will be 35 if knicks repeat to advance to second round of playoffs!!!;
That colors him old.
Hey, never back down, right?
He played 74 games last year. Last time he played that much was 2018-19 when he played 77 games. He has not played over 60 since then. (Was the covid season to factor in).
Amazing when guys get geared up for a contract year or extension how they play up! Kawhi same thing. He played 68 games this year, most since the 2018-19 season by far!!!
Do we think a sign and trade for OG straight up is possible here? Not optimal but both teams get something where they might have a player walk??
You never trade a 23yo for a 37yo guy
How about S&T OG for Jimmy Butler?
martin wrote:Who is down for this?
This would be really good. Avdija has become a player I’d be interested in alone.
Panos wrote:knixkik
Knicks would essentially send Randle to LA and PG comes back to the Knicks. Additional draft compensation to the clippers as needed.
Why are we including "additional draft compensation" when trading a younger All NBA player for an older one for double the money?
We're bailing them out and they get draft capital? How about the other way around for once? Why do we have to be the stooges?
I put as needed. I honestly don’t know what would be required. PG is older but a much better player obviously.
