VDesai wrote:Timmy was brickin' last night. I wished we let him take that 3 with the shot clock winding down.
We always get excited about players who have great games against us, when we would be the one team they dont play against. 
Saw this quote, maybe someone knows more about this stat..
3-pointers: DiVincenzo is sixth and Hardaway is seventh in added value via 3-point volume over the past week, per the Player Rate
https://fantasy.espn.com/basketball/play...
Timmy plays with a chip on his shoulder, loved playing for NY, and can still get buckets. I believe he is still one of the league leaders in taking charges. Learned that with the Hawks.
Timmy responded to a tough coach in Atlanta, I think he can do it again in NY, and give the bench some energy. THJ and Mitch in the second unit could be fun.
GustavBahler wrote:VDesai wrote:Timmy was brickin' last night. I wished we let him take that 3 with the shot clock winding down.
We always get excited about players who have great games against us, when we would be the one team they dont play against.
Saw this quote, maybe someone knows more about this stat..
3-pointers: DiVincenzo is sixth and Hardaway is seventh in added value via 3-point volume over the past week, per the Player Rate
https://fantasy.espn.com/basketball/play...
Timmy plays with a chip on his shoulder, loved playing for NY, and can still get buckets. I believe he is still one of the league leaders in taking charges. Learned that with the Hawks.
Timmy responded to a tough coach in Atlanta, I think he can do it again in NY, and give the bench some energy. THJ and Mitch in the second unit could be fun.
Agreed. I would like having him again.
Let’s talk about what the Knicks are allowed to do in the offseason:
They will go into the offseason as is with 10 guaranteed contract. Their starting 5, plus Mitch, deuce and the 3 rookies. Based on current numbers, they will have 11.5M in space below the second apron, and likely want to stay below. They do have access to the taxpayer MLE, which will be approx 5.5M for 2 years.
So do you keep Mitch, and try to fill out at least 4 roster spots with that 11.5M? Or do you move him for a player who makes less and open up some more flexibility. The roster charge for a veteran minimum contract will be 2.3M. Hypothetically, 11.5M is enough to use the taxpayer MLE, sign 2 vets on minimum contracts, and sign a 14th player to the second round exception contract, while keeping the 15th spot open like we are now. It’s tight but it works. Eligible players for the second round exception contract would be whomever we take in the late 2nd round in the 2025 draft, Kevin McCullar, James Nnaji from the Charlotte trade, or finally bringing over Jokubaitis.
Of course we could make a trade at the deadline or summer and this could look completely different, but it’s where things stand now.
jskinny35 wrote:We keep trying to find plugs around KAT to offset what he doesn't do well. Isiah Stewart would look nice next to him - is he a realistic trade target?
Yea the best path to true contention might be finding the perfect 4 for this team and having Josh Hart play an Iggy-GSW role off the bench as supersub point forward.
I don't see a championship level defense within this starting unit, we need to find a true 4 next to Towns and slide OG back to his natural position.
DLeethal wrote:jskinny35 wrote:We keep trying to find plugs around KAT to offset what he doesn't do well. Isiah Stewart would look nice next to him - is he a realistic trade target?
Yea the best path to true contention might be finding the perfect 4 for this team and having Josh Hart play an Iggy-GSW role off the bench as supersub point forward.
I don't see a championship level defense within this starting unit, we need to find a true 4 next to Towns and slide OG back to his natural position.
If we add a 4, he really needs to be able to shoot. Need to keep the spacing for KAT and Brunson.
I do wonder why the Knicks DIDN'T seem to seriously consider bringing over Rokas given the depth issues and his salary slot. He looked pretty good in summer league. I thought he would occupy the 2nd round salary slot, so in other words wouldnt create the veteran min problem with have with Shamet/Warren/Okeke where we can't afford the slot under the 2nd apron. Perhaps I was wrong about that and it was a cap issue. Can't remember.
BTW Rokas is having excellent season for Maccabi
https://www.euroleaguebasketball.net/en/...
12 pts, 5 asts, 3 rebs per game on over 50% shooting and close to 90% from the line. He just wrecked Real Madrid (and our old friend Mario Hezonja) with a 20/7/7 game.
Given he didn't come over this year, my guess is he may never come - but he's also not been used in a trade package which is also somewhat puzzling.
VDesai wrote:I do wonder why the Knicks DIDN'T seem to seriously consider bringing over Rokas given the depth issues and his salary slot. He looked pretty good in summer league. I thought he would occupy the 2nd round salary slot, so in other words wouldnt create the veteran min problem with have with Shamet/Warren/Okeke where we can't afford the slot under the 2nd apron. Perhaps I was wrong about that and it was a cap issue. Can't remember.BTW Rokas is having excellent season for Maccabi
https://www.euroleaguebasketball.net/en/...
12 pts, 5 asts, 3 rebs per game on over 50% shooting and close to 90% from the line. He just wrecked Real Madrid (and our old friend Mario Hezonja) with a 20/7/7 game.
Given he didn't come over this year, my guess is he may never come - but he's also not been used in a trade package which is also somewhat puzzling.
They probably just saw him as too overlapping with Kolek. Clearly they love Kolek, but hard to bring in both.
Knixkik wrote:VDesai wrote:I do wonder why the Knicks DIDN'T seem to seriously consider bringing over Rokas given the depth issues and his salary slot. He looked pretty good in summer league. I thought he would occupy the 2nd round salary slot, so in other words wouldnt create the veteran min problem with have with Shamet/Warren/Okeke where we can't afford the slot under the 2nd apron. Perhaps I was wrong about that and it was a cap issue. Can't remember.BTW Rokas is having excellent season for Maccabi
https://www.euroleaguebasketball.net/en/...
12 pts, 5 asts, 3 rebs per game on over 50% shooting and close to 90% from the line. He just wrecked Real Madrid (and our old friend Mario Hezonja) with a 20/7/7 game.
Given he didn't come over this year, my guess is he may never come - but he's also not been used in a trade package which is also somewhat puzzling.
They probably just saw him as too overlapping with Kolek. Clearly they love Kolek, but hard to bring in both.
He's not really hitting the three. I wonder if it's a product of him having to create more. There were other playmakers on Barca that could find him open.
VDesai wrote:I do wonder why the Knicks DIDN'T seem to seriously consider bringing over Rokas given the depth issues and his salary slot. He looked pretty good in summer league. I thought he would occupy the 2nd round salary slot, so in other words wouldnt create the veteran min problem with have with Shamet/Warren/Okeke where we can't afford the slot under the 2nd apron. Perhaps I was wrong about that and it was a cap issue. Can't remember.BTW Rokas is having excellent season for Maccabi
https://www.euroleaguebasketball.net/en/...
12 pts, 5 asts, 3 rebs per game on over 50% shooting and close to 90% from the line. He just wrecked Real Madrid (and our old friend Mario Hezonja) with a 20/7/7 game.
Given he didn't come over this year, my guess is he may never come - but he's also not been used in a trade package which is also somewhat puzzling.
He likely yea not given any assurances and perhaps money vs. his Euro gig.
Then there was Kolek. Time line perhaps with CamPayne had something to do with it?
Not like other teams wanted him via trade either?
One does not want to not play or go to Gleague when you have a Euro cred that is working.
Also, if you out of Thibs rotation, your not exactly a happy player.
Nalod wrote:VDesai wrote:I do wonder why the Knicks DIDN'T seem to seriously consider bringing over Rokas given the depth issues and his salary slot. He looked pretty good in summer league. I thought he would occupy the 2nd round salary slot, so in other words wouldnt create the veteran min problem with have with Shamet/Warren/Okeke where we can't afford the slot under the 2nd apron. Perhaps I was wrong about that and it was a cap issue. Can't remember.BTW Rokas is having excellent season for Maccabi
https://www.euroleaguebasketball.net/en/...
12 pts, 5 asts, 3 rebs per game on over 50% shooting and close to 90% from the line. He just wrecked Real Madrid (and our old friend Mario Hezonja) with a 20/7/7 game.
Given he didn't come over this year, my guess is he may never come - but he's also not been used in a trade package which is also somewhat puzzling.
He likely yea not given any assurances and perhaps money vs. his Euro gig.
Then there was Kolek. Time line perhaps with CamPayne had something to do with it?
Not like other teams wanted him via trade either?
One does not want to not play or go to Gleague when you have a Euro cred that is working.
Also, if you out of Thibs rotation, your not exactly a happy player.
I think both are it. From Rokas perspective, why would you want to come to a team with Brunson and Payne, and then also Kolek. He prob makes same or more money and could start in Europe.
Well, with Richards (Suns) and Herb Jones (Season-ending injury), need to pivot on possible reinforcements.
Clearing a little cap space to add Warren and/or Okeke seems to be the easiest route. Warren is leading the GLeague forwards in points pg (25). Okeke is leading all forwards in assists (4.9).
The return of Mitch Robinson vs a trade for Valancius is another concept. I'm more of a believer in Robinson than most so, I am not sure its an improvement, when healthy. In a direct swap, the extra cap space would enable the addition of potentially both Warren and Okeke - assuming a roster spot is cleared (rumors of shopping Sims). This would balance the roster more.
Brunson / Cam / Kolek
Hart / McBride / Shamet
Bridges / Warren / Dadiet
OG / Precious / Okeke
KAT / JV / Huk
JV is a bit older but has been consistently healthy. Strong rebounder and finishes well offensively. Shoots about 80% from the line so wouldn't be a liability in closing minutes. Defense is somewhat neutral, from stats, averaging about 1.2 blocks per 36 and an average of about 0 DPM.
I don't hate it. Just love MitchBeast and want to see him healthy and beating up opposing bigs on the block. Unemotionally, JV might provide more value over the next three years at a lower cost.
EwingsGlass wrote:Well, with Richards (Suns) and Herb Jones (Season-ending injury), need to pivot on possible reinforcements. Clearing a little cap space to add Warren and/or Okeke seems to be the easiest route. Warren is leading the GLeague forwards in points pg (25). Okeke is leading all forwards in assists (4.9).
The return of Mitch Robinson vs a trade for Valancius is another concept. I'm more of a believer in Robinson than most so, I am not sure its an improvement, when healthy. In a direct swap, the extra cap space would enable the addition of potentially both Warren and Okeke - assuming a roster spot is cleared (rumors of shopping Sims). This would balance the roster more.
Brunson / Cam / Kolek
Hart / McBride / Shamet
Bridges / Warren / Dadiet
OG / Precious / Okeke
KAT / JV / Huk
JV is a bit older but has been consistently healthy. Strong rebounder and finishes well offensively. Shoots about 80% from the line so wouldn't be a liability in closing minutes. Defense is somewhat neutral, from stats, averaging about 1.2 blocks per 36 and an average of about 0 DPM.
I don't hate it. Just love MitchBeast and want to see him healthy and beating up opposing bigs on the block. Unemotionally, JV might provide more value over the next three years at a lower cost.
Mitch is more valuable to us when he plays, but JV is cheaper and plays more as you said, so you have a full time center plus an extra 3M or so to play with in the offseason for added depth, which this team needs. It’s not necessary the answer, but it’s an option. And if you made the deal now, you have that space for Warren or whomever else.
The delicate scenario is doing a trade mid season vs. off season.
How close are we really from contending?
Boston is not shooting well these days. It happens.
teams go thru funks. Is that where we at?
Teams usually don't have three top 10 league minutes leaders at one time.
The Fatigue thing is real but if our bench puts the team in deficits or loses leads over the long sample then coach knows best. we can second guess what is not verified.
The longer this goes on, the more our bench might be solved?
As we know, TJ can cope on in March. Kolek has to unseat Cam. That only happens if Cam gets injured.
And Mitch returns, is healthy, and is impactful.
Then is there a place where He and Kat exist, where Josh goes to the bench and Mikal is the 2, OG the 3?
Josh has been great this season. His playmaking is vastly improved and his shooting as well. All on a very good contract!!! This is what happens when player gets long term security. They can work on their game and not be fearful of making mistakes.
Makes him great trade fodder if need be. Would hate that but there is that reality. At some point MIkal will want his extension and things are going to get expensive.
Thats for another time.
If I had to predict, the real window opens next year.
Nalod wrote:The delicate scenario is doing a trade mid season vs. off season.
How close are we really from contending?
Boston is not shooting well these days. It happens.
teams go thru funks. Is that where we at?
Teams usually don't have three top 10 league minutes leaders at one time.
The Fatigue thing is real but if our bench puts the team in deficits or loses leads over the long sample then coach knows best. we can second guess what is not verified.
The longer this goes on, the more our bench might be solved?
As we know, TJ can cope on in March. Kolek has to unseat Cam. That only happens if Cam gets injured.
And Mitch returns, is healthy, and is impactful.
Then is there a place where He and Kat exist, where Josh goes to the bench and Mikal is the 2, OG the 3?Josh has been great this season. His playmaking is vastly improved and his shooting as well. All on a very good contract!!! This is what happens when player gets long term security. They can work on their game and not be fearful of making mistakes.
Makes him great trade fodder if need be. Would hate that but there is that reality. At some point MIkal will want his extension and things are going to get expensive.
Thats for another time.
If I had to predict, the real window opens next year.
Making a move now is kind of a weird cap situation thing. So many actions in the offseason trigger hard caps that if there is a move you want to make, and can make it this season within the hard cap you and your trade partner already have, it leaves more flexibility later. A trade like this would hard cap the Wiz this year. They might be ok being hard-capped this year. Ice in winter. Are they gonna be willing to hard cap next offseason? This season gets us about a 4.4mm TPE (over the vet minimum). Next season that TPE drops below 2mm with Mitch's contract decreasing, essentially less than the league vet minimum. So, a valuable TPE becomes worthless by waiting.
Its not as straightforward as waiting is better. Got to fit within cap puzzles as well.
Gotta wonder if the Knicks at this point have already seen the market for Mitch and realize there's nothing for them to do. Maybe it makes more sense to wait for Mitch and play him (for however long he lasts).
It does create a logjam when he returns - so shedding Jericho's 2.5-3mm makes sense - he's probably not getting re-signed and he will be surplus. Maybe someone takes a chance on his athleticsm - it doesn't really matter what we get back, as we can use the salary savings to call up TJ Warren or Chuma Okeke, who are the equivalent or better than what we can get out there. Unless you can flip Sims+ picks for the likes of Alec Burks - and I think there's an argument for that, but not exactly a needle mover.
So then its more likely they move the likes of Achiuwa or Payne. Achiuwa has less of a role if Mitch returns and gets time and a moveable salary. If you think Kolek is ready, its easy to stack Payne's 3mm min and get a 9mm salary back. That puts you in a range to get some wings that maybe can help. Simone Fontecchio's name has been thrown out there. I personally like Cody Martin- he's a rugged defender, a pretty good rebounder - hits an occasional 3, but has offense beyond that. Its the kind of extra wing who could make a difference for us to keep people fresh.
VDesai wrote:Gotta wonder if the Knicks at this point have already seen the market for Mitch and realize there's nothing for them to do. Maybe it makes more sense to wait for Mitch and play him (for however long he lasts). It does create a logjam when he returns - so shedding Jericho's 2.5-3mm makes sense - he's probably not getting re-signed and he will be surplus. Maybe someone takes a chance on his athleticsm - it doesn't really matter what we get back, as we can use the salary savings to call up TJ Warren or Chuma Okeke, who are the equivalent or better than what we can get out there. Unless you can flip Sims+ picks for the likes of Alec Burks - and I think there's an argument for that, but not exactly a needle mover.
So then its more likely they move the likes of Achiuwa or Payne. Achiuwa has less of a role if Mitch returns and gets time and a moveable salary. If you think Kolek is ready, its easy to stack Payne's 3mm min and get a 9mm salary back. That puts you in a range to get some wings that maybe can help. Simone Fontecchio's name has been thrown out there. I personally like Cody Martin- he's a rugged defender, a pretty good rebounder - hits an occasional 3, but has offense beyond that. Its the kind of extra wing who could make a difference for us to keep people fresh.
Mitch has been shopped this summer. He is hurt so his value is low, too low for Knicks or they would have traded him by now.
There is just no way you trade Payne unless you are getting something similar back. Zero chance Knicks think Kolek or Deuce could replace his role as backup PG for this upcoming stretch run.
Man, if Achiuwa had the iHart push shot, he would be invaluable as a backup PF/C, even with Mitch in the picture.
