Off Topic · Yankees Talk thread (page 162)

abreu signs with the angels for $5 mil + incentives.

Posted by islesfan:
Why did Selig, Dupay and the rest of MLB, ignore PED's and were so late in getting any kind of testing policy into the game? Why did Fehr and Orza ignore the concerns of players not using PED's and why were they more interested in increasing salaries than the health and well being of the players they represented? And why did it take threats from Congress to get them to allow testing?

Well, they did try to get steroid testing back in '93 but the players union shot it down. I think they did try to an extent but the players were never going to go for it because of how widespread it was.

Posted by djsunyc:

abreu signs with the angels for $5 mil + incentives.

that is ridiculously cheap... how much in incentives can he earn? i woulda much rather re-signed him than at that rate than trade for Nick Swisher's big money contract.

Posted by TMS:

Posted by djsunyc:

abreu signs with the angels for $5 mil + incentives.

that is ridiculously cheap... how much in incentives can he earn? i woulda much rather re-signed him than at that rate than trade for Nick Swisher's big money contract.

I sincerely doubt that Abreu would have taken a 66% salary cut to re-sign here. It wouldn't have made any sense to wait until camp was about to open, just to wait him out.

Good contract for the Angels but they really needed him and still had an opening in their OF and lineup heading into camp.

I can't believe how many players are still out there. Yankees should sign Manny to take away all the attention away from ARod.

Manny won't sign for no 1 year deal i don't think... he'll wait out Spring Training if he has to IMO

Posted by TMS:

Posted by djsunyc:

abreu signs with the angels for $5 mil + incentives.

that is ridiculously cheap... how much in incentives can he earn? i woulda much rather re-signed him than at that rate than trade for Nick Swisher's big money contract.

Agreed 100%. That is absurdly cheap for a hitter of his caliber.

i have decently high hopes for Swish & i think he'll be a positive addition, i'm just stunned to see Abreu sign at such a bargain basement rate... i was sure he wouldn't agree to anything under $10 mil per at the very least, much less on a 1 year deal... i know this market is tough but wow, that's a shocker.

[Edited by - TMS on 02-11-2009 4:02 PM]

apparently Yanks offered Andruw Jones a minor league contract but he opted to sign w/TEX instead cuz he likes their hitting coach... at least we made an offer, so i'm happy about that... if Jones can't make the Rangers' roster out of ST maybe we can bring him in for a tryout... the Rangers definitely have more competition at the CF position than we currently do, so he might be able to find more playing time here... & if he does find a spot on the Rangers' roster, it might open up an opportunity to trade for 1 of their capable backups like Marlon Byrd, who i've been saying would make a really nice platoon partner w/either Melky or Gardner.

http://www.prosportsdaily.com/comments/r...

[Edited by - TMS on 02-11-2009 4:29 PM]

Posted by Bonn1997:

Posted by TMS:

i don't think u can take any of the words from ARod to be truthful anymore

Yeah, I think you're 100% right. I think the leaking of his name was simply wrong since the players volunteered to do the testing under the condition of anonymity.

That whole list has to be leaked now. And what was the entire point of testing them, to only exchange it for anonymity?? Who was it supposed to benefit to keep it hush hush to begin with?

These assholes should have been tested and the test handled whatever way the powers that be would want to use it as far as the public was concerned.

It's always been 'okay, we get to test them, find out who cheated and then keep it from the public'. That's nuts. I mean did they really think it would never be leaked?

I think it was a BIG mistake for the Yankees to take the position of not liquidating A-Roids contract. When you pay good money for a product, you should get something good back in return. Well A-Roid is no good anymore. It's a faulty product and it ain't going to sell anymore. He's already going to lose a good portion of his endorsements and he's on his way down. And there's no way MLB is going to let him off the hook.

Everywhere we go, we're going to see the signs in the stands. 'A-Roid' 'A-Roid' 'A-Roid' It's going to be a BIG distraction. We saw it happen to Bonds and the rest and it isn't going away.

I think Hank made his first big mistake. I really thought they should have made a stink out of it, did something to try to rid us of his contract (or reduce it) and start concentrating on the farm system again. Big mistake in my opinion.

ARod isn't gonna be productive anymore? says who? i will personally guarantee u that he hits at least 40 HR's this season & drives in over 110 RBI & leads the league in OPS for all ML 3B... i wouldn't be surprised to see him put up phenomenal #'s this year just like in '07 cuz he's out to prove to the public that he can put up #'s with or w/o steroids (not that he isn't necessarily still on the HGH, but whatever, the same suspicion is cast on every single player in baseball at this point)

Posted by TMS:

ARod isn't gonna be productive anymore? says who? i will personally guarantee u that he hits at least 40 HR's this season & drives in over 110 RBI & leads the league in OPS for all ML 3B... i wouldn't be surprised to see him put up phenomenal #'s this year just like in '07 cuz he's out to prove to the public that he can put up #'s with or w/o steroids (not that he isn't necessarily still on the HGH, but whatever, the same suspicion is cast on every single player in baseball at this point)

I didn't say he wouldn't be productive (under normal circumstances). This is different. We can't just brush this under the rug. Especially if your a Yankee. And if he's so good at proving to the public that he can put up numbers, then why can't he do it in the playoffs? Not to change the subject here. Point being, don't fool yourself that this is gonna go away. I have a guy I work with who's wife's father is connected to Hank somehow and this guys is going to be sitting with the Yankees for a few days, in the dugout in ST soon and he's going to fill us in on what the media frenzy's going to be like. I can't wait and I'll let you's know what he says when he gets back.

i dunno but i get a strange feeling that having this out in the open now is gonna help ARod relax at the plate in big situations... i could be completely off base here & i guess we'll see how it goes this season, but if anything's gonna help to relax him, it's finally not having to worry about this dirty little secret getting out anymore.

if it isn't having to hide it all, then it's having to hide period.

We'll see how this plays out.

Hammerin' Hank Aaron: Was he on 'Roids?

Protrade, a sports equipment journal, suggests the unthinkable: Hank Aaron juiced during his great career that resulted in the all-time home run record now pursued by Barry Bonds.

The San Francisco Chronicle, in a May 3rd 2005 article quoted former Major League pitcher Tom House of the Atlanta Braves as saying that steroids were rampant in the game in the late '60s and throughout the '70s.

House, perhaps best known for catching Hank Aaron's 715th home run ball in 1974 in the Atlanta Braves bullpen, said he and several teammates used amphetamines, human growth hormone and 'whatever steroid' they could find in order to keep up with the competition.

"I pretty much popped everything cold turkey', House said. "We were doing steroids they wouldn't give to horses. That was the '60s when nobody knew. The good thing is, we know now. There's a lot more research and understanding."

House, 58, estimated that six or seven pitchers per team were at least experimenting with steroids or human growth hormone. He said players talked about losing to opponents using more effective drugs,

"We didn't get beat, we got out-milligrammed", he said. "And when you found out what they were taking, you started taking them".

Congress suggested that Baseball hid a steroid problem. However, as you will read Bowie Kuhn suppressed that notion. After the jump, Protrade's incredible argument about Aaron's juice.

According to Rep. Henry A. Waxman in his March 17,2005 opening statement before the House Government Reform Committee:

"Congress first investigated drugs and professional sports, including steroids over 30 years ago. I think perhaps the only two people in the room who will remember this are me and Commissioner Selig, because I believe he became owner in 1970".

In 1973, the year I first ran for Congress, the House Committee on Interstate and Foreign Commerce concluded a year-long investigation that found--and I quote--"drug use exists...in all sports and levels of competition...In some instances, the danger of improper drug use--primarily amphetamines and anabolic steroids--can only be described as alarming". Bowie Kuhn, and the powers that be at the time, quietly squashed the entire tawdry episode and with good reason: it would cast suspicions on an African-American slugger who was challenging one of baseball's most cherished records: The career record for home runs.

Compare Hank Aaron's stats at the beginning of his career and then notice how his HR% began to increase beginning when Hammerin' Hank was 37 years old.

HR% is defined as being the number of HRs per 100 ABs.

Age-HRs-HR%
33-44-7.3
34-39-6.5
35-29-4.8

Nothing unusual about these statistics; it is a typical profile of a slugger in decline as he ages. But then Hank began to undergo an 'enhancement.'

Age-HRs-HR%
36-44-8.0
37-38-7.4

What explains this spike at a latter age? Expansion? Perhaps. But then what happens?

Age-HRs-HR%
38-47-9.5
39-34-7.6

Hank...What's going on buddy? Aaron's HR% were TOPS in the NL in both 1971 and 1972. Hmm.

Age-HRs-HR%
40-40-10.2

Which leads us to 1973 when at age 40 in just 392 at bats, juiced 40 HR's for a HR% of 10.2. Once again TOPS in NL for the THIRD STRAIGHT YEAR and the HIGHEST HR% in the ENTIRE 23 year career of Hank Aaron.

Hank Aaron at 40 was not the only Atlanta Brave to hit 40 Hrs that season. Teammates Darrell Evans and Davey Johnson blasted 41 and 43 HRs respectively.

Darrell Evans

Year-HRs-HR%
1971-12-4.6
1972-19-4.5

1973-41-6.9

1974-25-4.4
1975-22-2.8

Notice a statistical anomaly? Let's see what Davey Johnson did.

Davey Johnson

Year-HRs-HR%
1971-18-3.5
1972-5-1.3

1973-43-7.7

1974-15-3.3
1975 Played 1 game
1976 Did not play MLB

Notice a statistical anomaly? It would be one thing for Hank Aaron to undergo an 'enhancement', but what are the odds that not one but TWO teammates would both have career years in HR's and HR% in the SAME YEAR as when a Congressional Committee issued its final report saying that anabolic steroids were rampant in the game? Why did Darrell Evans and Davey Johnson both experience career spikes in HR's only to return to earth the following year? And how did Hank finish up?

Age-HRs-HR%
41-20-5.9
42-12-2.6
43-10-3.7

So what happened? Enquiring minds want to know.

The 1996 Baltimore Orioles set at the time the team HR record for one season. Brady Anderson's 50 HR season was viewed suspiciously.

The manager of the 1996 Baltimore Orioles? Davey Johnson.

The only question remains: What did Bud Selig know and when did he know it?

Fay Vincent circulated a draft steroids policy in 1991. Selig knew that if the scab of steroids was picked off, the puss of the 1973 Atlanta Braves would be oozing all over the game. The scandal of Hank Aaron's HR record being tainted by steroids use would have been a PR disaster at the time and. personally, extremely painful to Bud Selig who, after all, is a long-time friend of Hank Aaron.

Hence the boardroom coup which ousted Fay Vincent and made Bud Selig 'Acting Commissioner', while still maintaining his position as the owner of the Milwaukee Brewers, a blatant conflict of interest.

So long as Bud Selig remains in charge of Major League Baseball, the American public will never get to the bottom of the steroids scandal which has sullied the game. He has too much of a personal vested interest in Hank Aaron.

Besides, after this season, Barry Lamar Bonds will BE the HR KING.

http://grg51.typepad.com/steroid_nation/2007/02/hammerin_hank_a.html

[Edited by - djsunyc on 02-16-2009 2:13 PM]

very interesting article here which came out a couple years ago... i wonder why Sen. Mitchell & Bud Selig never commissioned a Congressional investigative committee to look into all those "suspect" records that were put up during the 60s & 70s? the hypocrisy around this entire steroid witch hunt is mind boggling.

Major records have fallen and A-Roid is so full of shit. This, respectfully, is no witch hunt. If whether A-Roid said Roids or not, why was he apologizing two weeks ago? And your right about one thing above. It's all a bunch of hypocrisy - across the board.

Posted by djsunyc:

Hammerin' Hank Aaron: Was he on 'Roids?

Protrade, a sports equipment journal, suggests the unthinkable: Hank Aaron juiced during his great career that resulted in the all-time home run record now pursued by Barry Bonds.

The San Francisco Chronicle, in a May 3rd 2005 article quoted former Major League pitcher Tom House of the Atlanta Braves as saying that steroids were rampant in the game in the late '60s and throughout the '70s.

House, perhaps best known for catching Hank Aaron's 715th home run ball in 1974 in the Atlanta Braves bullpen, said he and several teammates used amphetamines, human growth hormone and 'whatever steroid' they could find in order to keep up with the competition.

"I pretty much popped everything cold turkey', House said. "We were doing steroids they wouldn't give to horses. That was the '60s when nobody knew. The good thing is, we know now. There's a lot more research and understanding."

House, 58, estimated that six or seven pitchers per team were at least experimenting with steroids or human growth hormone. He said players talked about losing to opponents using more effective drugs,

"We didn't get beat, we got out-milligrammed", he said. "And when you found out what they were taking, you started taking them".

Congress suggested that Baseball hid a steroid problem. However, as you will read Bowie Kuhn suppressed that notion. After the jump, Protrade's incredible argument about Aaron's juice.

According to Rep. Henry A. Waxman in his March 17,2005 opening statement before the House Government Reform Committee:

"Congress first investigated drugs and professional sports, including steroids over 30 years ago. I think perhaps the only two people in the room who will remember this are me and Commissioner Selig, because I believe he became owner in 1970".

In 1973, the year I first ran for Congress, the House Committee on Interstate and Foreign Commerce concluded a year-long investigation that found--and I quote--"drug use exists...in all sports and levels of competition...In some instances, the danger of improper drug use--primarily amphetamines and anabolic steroids--can only be described as alarming". Bowie Kuhn, and the powers that be at the time, quietly squashed the entire tawdry episode and with good reason: it would cast suspicions on an African-American slugger who was challenging one of baseball's most cherished records: The career record for home runs.

Compare Hank Aaron's stats at the beginning of his career and then notice how his HR% began to increase beginning when Hammerin' Hank was 37 years old.

HR% is defined as being the number of HRs per 100 ABs.

Age-HRs-HR%
33-44-7.3
34-39-6.5
35-29-4.8

Nothing unusual about these statistics; it is a typical profile of a slugger in decline as he ages. But then Hank began to undergo an 'enhancement.'

Age-HRs-HR%
36-44-8.0
37-38-7.4

What explains this spike at a latter age? Expansion? Perhaps. But then what happens?

Age-HRs-HR%
38-47-9.5
39-34-7.6

Hank...What's going on buddy? Aaron's HR% were TOPS in the NL in both 1971 and 1972. Hmm.

Age-HRs-HR%
40-40-10.2

Which leads us to 1973 when at age 40 in just 392 at bats, juiced 40 HR's for a HR% of 10.2. Once again TOPS in NL for the THIRD STRAIGHT YEAR and the HIGHEST HR% in the ENTIRE 23 year career of Hank Aaron.

Hank Aaron at 40 was not the only Atlanta Brave to hit 40 Hrs that season. Teammates Darrell Evans and Davey Johnson blasted 41 and 43 HRs respectively.

Darrell Evans

Year-HRs-HR%
1971-12-4.6
1972-19-4.5

1973-41-6.9

1974-25-4.4
1975-22-2.8

Notice a statistical anomaly? Let's see what Davey Johnson did.

Davey Johnson

Year-HRs-HR%
1971-18-3.5
1972-5-1.3

1973-43-7.7

1974-15-3.3
1975 Played 1 game
1976 Did not play MLB

Notice a statistical anomaly? It would be one thing for Hank Aaron to undergo an 'enhancement', but what are the odds that not one but TWO teammates would both have career years in HR's and HR% in the SAME YEAR as when a Congressional Committee issued its final report saying that anabolic steroids were rampant in the game? Why did Darrell Evans and Davey Johnson both experience career spikes in HR's only to return to earth the following year? And how did Hank finish up?

Age-HRs-HR%
41-20-5.9
42-12-2.6
43-10-3.7

So what happened? Enquiring minds want to know.

The 1996 Baltimore Orioles set at the time the team HR record for one season. Brady Anderson's 50 HR season was viewed suspiciously.

The manager of the 1996 Baltimore Orioles? Davey Johnson.

The only question remains: What did Bud Selig know and when did he know it?

Fay Vincent circulated a draft steroids policy in 1991. Selig knew that if the scab of steroids was picked off, the puss of the 1973 Atlanta Braves would be oozing all over the game. The scandal of Hank Aaron's HR record being tainted by steroids use would have been a PR disaster at the time and. personally, extremely painful to Bud Selig who, after all, is a long-time friend of Hank Aaron.

Hence the boardroom coup which ousted Fay Vincent and made Bud Selig 'Acting Commissioner', while still maintaining his position as the owner of the Milwaukee Brewers, a blatant conflict of interest.

So long as Bud Selig remains in charge of Major League Baseball, the American public will never get to the bottom of the steroids scandal which has sullied the game. He has too much of a personal vested interest in Hank Aaron.

Besides, after this season, Barry Lamar Bonds will BE the HR KING.

http://grg51.typepad.com/steroid_nation/2007/02/hammerin_hank_a.html

[Edited by - djsunyc on 02-16-2009 2:13 PM]

I'd rather take Aaron over bonds any day. I never once heard of Aaron juicing, not until I read the above. Aaron was simply one of the most consistent players around and never hit more than 47 home runs. It just all added up over a 22 year span. And it's not impossible for a player to play 20 plus years. It's already been proven many times over. Look at Satchel Page? He was about what' 47 when he finally got a chance in the majors. Was he on roids too?

Besides, Babe Ruth hit 714 home runs in less at bats than Aaron and bonds. About 800 less then bonds and about 3,000 less then Aaron. What do you's think he would have gotten if he had had' at least an extra 800 at bats?

We already know who is still the undisputed king of the HR! And he was a pitcher his first five years. Not to mention a drunk and very inconsistent, but by all accounts great when he was on.

Have we forgotten that the man wore the pins and put us on the map? Where's the respect?

Posted by djsunyc:

Hammerin' Hank Aaron: Was he on 'Roids?

Protrade, a sports equipment journal, suggests the unthinkable: Hank Aaron juiced during his great career that resulted in the all-time home run record now pursued by Barry Bonds.

The San Francisco Chronicle, in a May 3rd 2005 article quoted former Major League pitcher Tom House of the Atlanta Braves as saying that steroids were rampant in the game in the late '60s and throughout the '70s.

House, perhaps best known for catching Hank Aaron's 715th home run ball in 1974 in the Atlanta Braves bullpen, said he and several teammates used amphetamines, human growth hormone and 'whatever steroid' they could find in order to keep up with the competition.

"I pretty much popped everything cold turkey', House said. "We were doing steroids they wouldn't give to horses. That was the '60s when nobody knew. The good thing is, we know now. There's a lot more research and understanding."

House, 58, estimated that six or seven pitchers per team were at least experimenting with steroids or human growth hormone. He said players talked about losing to opponents using more effective drugs,

"We didn't get beat, we got out-milligrammed", he said. "And when you found out what they were taking, you started taking them".

Congress suggested that Baseball hid a steroid problem. However, as you will read Bowie Kuhn suppressed that notion. After the jump, Protrade's incredible argument about Aaron's juice.

According to Rep. Henry A. Waxman in his March 17,2005 opening statement before the House Government Reform Committee:

"Congress first investigated drugs and professional sports, including steroids over 30 years ago. I think perhaps the only two people in the room who will remember this are me and Commissioner Selig, because I believe he became owner in 1970".

In 1973, the year I first ran for Congress, the House Committee on Interstate and Foreign Commerce concluded a year-long investigation that found--and I quote--"drug use exists...in all sports and levels of competition...In some instances, the danger of improper drug use--primarily amphetamines and anabolic steroids--can only be described as alarming". Bowie Kuhn, and the powers that be at the time, quietly squashed the entire tawdry episode and with good reason: it would cast suspicions on an African-American slugger who was challenging one of baseball's most cherished records: The career record for home runs.

Compare Hank Aaron's stats at the beginning of his career and then notice how his HR% began to increase beginning when Hammerin' Hank was 37 years old.

HR% is defined as being the number of HRs per 100 ABs.

Age-HRs-HR%
33-44-7.3
34-39-6.5
35-29-4.8

Nothing unusual about these statistics; it is a typical profile of a slugger in decline as he ages. But then Hank began to undergo an 'enhancement.'

Age-HRs-HR%
36-44-8.0
37-38-7.4

What explains this spike at a latter age? Expansion? Perhaps. But then what happens?

Age-HRs-HR%
38-47-9.5
39-34-7.6

Hank...What's going on buddy? Aaron's HR% were TOPS in the NL in both 1971 and 1972. Hmm.

Age-HRs-HR%
40-40-10.2

Which leads us to 1973 when at age 40 in just 392 at bats, juiced 40 HR's for a HR% of 10.2. Once again TOPS in NL for the THIRD STRAIGHT YEAR and the HIGHEST HR% in the ENTIRE 23 year career of Hank Aaron.

Hank Aaron at 40 was not the only Atlanta Brave to hit 40 Hrs that season. Teammates Darrell Evans and Davey Johnson blasted 41 and 43 HRs respectively.

Darrell Evans

Year-HRs-HR%
1971-12-4.6
1972-19-4.5

1973-41-6.9

1974-25-4.4
1975-22-2.8

Notice a statistical anomaly? Let's see what Davey Johnson did.

Davey Johnson

Year-HRs-HR%
1971-18-3.5
1972-5-1.3

1973-43-7.7

1974-15-3.3
1975 Played 1 game
1976 Did not play MLB

Notice a statistical anomaly? It would be one thing for Hank Aaron to undergo an 'enhancement', but what are the odds that not one but TWO teammates would both have career years in HR's and HR% in the SAME YEAR as when a Congressional Committee issued its final report saying that anabolic steroids were rampant in the game? Why did Darrell Evans and Davey Johnson both experience career spikes in HR's only to return to earth the following year? And how did Hank finish up?

Age-HRs-HR%
41-20-5.9
42-12-2.6
43-10-3.7

So what happened? Enquiring minds want to know.

The 1996 Baltimore Orioles set at the time the team HR record for one season. Brady Anderson's 50 HR season was viewed suspiciously.

The manager of the 1996 Baltimore Orioles? Davey Johnson.

The only question remains: What did Bud Selig know and when did he know it?

Fay Vincent circulated a draft steroids policy in 1991. Selig knew that if the scab of steroids was picked off, the puss of the 1973 Atlanta Braves would be oozing all over the game. The scandal of Hank Aaron's HR record being tainted by steroids use would have been a PR disaster at the time and. personally, extremely painful to Bud Selig who, after all, is a long-time friend of Hank Aaron.

Hence the boardroom coup which ousted Fay Vincent and made Bud Selig 'Acting Commissioner', while still maintaining his position as the owner of the Milwaukee Brewers, a blatant conflict of interest.

So long as Bud Selig remains in charge of Major League Baseball, the American public will never get to the bottom of the steroids scandal which has sullied the game. He has too much of a personal vested interest in Hank Aaron.

Besides, after this season, Barry Lamar Bonds will BE the HR KING.

http://grg51.typepad.com/steroid_nation/2007/02/hammerin_hank_a.html

[Edited by - djsunyc on 02-16-2009 2:13 PM]

We have no idea what kind of stuff these players did. I think I'm just gonna judge them by what they did on the field and what needles they stuck in their body is none of my business. That holds whether it's A-Rod, Aaron, Bonds, or Pettitte.

[Edited by - bonn1997 on 02-16-2009 7:53 PM]

Don't cheap'n yourself when it comes to quality of the brawn. Don't support the cheaters club.

Hold MLB to the highest quality of standards. Never except anything less ma man.