JamesKPolk wrote:holfresh is a sad human being. Trying to prop up mediocre Woodson as some excellent coach because he was screaming and yelling about how awful D'Antoni was and how much better Woodson was when in the end Woodson has turned into another D'Antoni. Now he's just trying to save face with some BS about a mediocre coach.And you talk about clowns.
Keep supporting Dolan, Isiah, Marbury and now Woodson. You sure choose them well.
JamesKPolk - enough with the personal vendetta. holfresh stated an opinion. Same as you.
Do you consider Glen Grunwald a failure?
Anyone suggesting the firing of Mike Woodson should also be an advocate of firing the man who hired him.
And the man who hired him.
Get real.
I can only hope the Knicks' play over the last 2 months only represents a coaching slump that Woodson can recover from, but as many balanced posters have said, our coach deserves both props and criticism.
Truth is we've played very well and our record shows for it. When we want to, we can put up a show. It has happened since Woody has been the coach.
But its also truth we've been mediocre after a blistering start this season. We would be a .500 team without that start. Its true the team has motivation and focus deficiencies. Defense, Woody's supposed bread and butter, has been mediocre. Lately we can't beat contenders, even if our team is supposed to be built for the playoffs and for that matter, for matchups like those. And in those many losses, we've shown deficiencies making in-game adjustments and calling the right offensive plays. Iso basketball won't get you anywhere in the playoffs, ask Woody's Hawlks.
So while it is fair to give Woody props for his record, its also fair to express concerns about many aspects of his coaching.
We'll see what happens in the playoffs, but the road to them has been mostly mediocre.
Insanity. Just goes to show why you can't pat attention to the press or fans in NY. You produce they still hate you. Yo fail epically and a few years later they think you should be in the HOF. Remember the good riddance on Ewing? Fits the mold. We try to justify our toxic attitude toward our stars and talent(players and coaches) by saying that you have to be tough to play in NY and players that don't have what it takes. Fact is why would you want to play here? You got stupid fans, aggressive press, high taxes and cost of living and relatively inclement weather. You think Durant or Lebron or losing marketing or advertising dollars being where they are?
NY fans may be very knowledgeable but as far as judgment goes near the bottom of the country.
Fair and Balanced? Where have I heard that before?
So while it is fair to give Woody props for his record, its also fair to express concerns about many aspects of his coaching.
knicksfan - concerns about his coaching? You mean like the tshirts he wears to practice? Yes, he was popped for a tshirt at practice. Dissension in the locker room? How he looks on television? Not enough minutes for (insert name here)?
The false equivalency of balancing a superior record with individual opinion is utterly and completely bogus.
Your mind-numbing measure of "equal" would only hold water if Mike Woodson won equally as he lost.
55-28
Results gents, results...Lets say u have a job where your boss gives u a budget to make 10 mil selling product X in a given year...U start out the gates burning rubber by making 7 mil in the first 3 months...Next nine months u make 4 mil..So your pace slowed but u made budget...The boss should fire you because u didn't keep up the pace no one expected u to produce profit at in the first place???..U guys kidding me???
Absolutely
holfresh wrote:Results gents, results...Lets say u have a job where your boss gives u a budget to make 10 mil selling product X in a given year...U start out the gates burning rubber by making 7 mil in the first 3 months...Next nine months u make 4 mil..So your pace slowed but u made budget...The boss should fire you because u didn't keep up the pace no one expected u to produce profit at in the first place???..U guys kidding me???
the criteria for excellence just got raised. Nationally televised games? 50 wins? Eastern Conference contender? A championship in his first season?
The world is not enough.
nykshaknbake wrote:Insanity. Just goes to show why you can't pat attention to the press or fans in NY. You produce they still hate you. Yo fail epically and a few years later they think you should be in the HOF. Remember the good riddance on Ewing? Fits the mold. We try to justify our toxic attitude toward our stars and talent(players and coaches) by saying that you have to be tough to play in NY and players that don't have what it takes. Fact is why would you want to play here? You got stupid fans, aggressive press, high taxes and cost of living and relatively inclement weather. You think Durant or Lebron or losing marketing or advertising dollars being where they are?
NY fans may be very knowledgeable but as far as judgment goes near the bottom of the country.
Woodson is playing Felton and not complaining while George Karl and Nate McMillan wanted to get rid of Felton for obvious reasons.
Woodson is dealing with alot of personalities and we haven't heard any issues between the players and coach.
Fun Read, http://www.slamonline.com/online/nba/201...
misterearl wrote:Fair and Balanced? Where have I heard that before?So while it is fair to give Woody props for his record, its also fair to express concerns about many aspects of his coaching.
knicksfan - concerns about his coaching? You mean like the tshirts he wears to practice? Yes, he was popped for a tshirt at practice. Dissension in the locker room? How he looks on television? Not enough minutes for (insert name here)?
The false equivalency of balancing a superior record with individual opinion is utterly and completely bogus.
Your mind-numbing measure of "equal" would only hold water if Mike Woodson won equally as he lost.
55-28
Is that the best you have, earl? Making fun of my post by suggesting those ridiculous aspects of the game?
So if you don't agree, you just make fun of others? Kinda bullish, don't you think?
Knicksfan - read the post again. In your haste to defend yourself, you missed the point entirely.
Nor did your rebuttal hold any root beer.
misterearl wrote:Knicksfan - read the post again. In your haste to defend yourself, you missed the point entirely.Nor did your rebuttal hold any root beer.
Dude, the only point you made was a straw man. Instead of responding to points made by Knicksfan and others in this thread you reach back to some ridiculous point that you claim someone else made months ago to create a false equivalence between the complaints. If you have no problem with the lineups, the minute distribution, and the play-calling, especially at the end of games, then SAY THAT. But your straw man arguments only derail threads and don't move the discussion forward any.
misterearl wrote:Knicksfan - read the post again. In your haste to defend yourself, you missed the point entirely.Nor did your rebuttal hold any root beer.
Yes, shall we talk about the tshirts he wears in practice, how he looks on TV and the minutes for (insert the name here).
I get it, you rightfully think Woodson has done a good job, has a great record with us and doesn't deserve nitpicking from the madness of NY fans. Its all about the record. Cool.
I respect that opinion. Its not like I don't agree to some extent because Woody does have a good record and that doesn't happen by osmosis. But there are aspects of his coaching, not only here but during his career, that are reasons to be concerned.
But won't get into details with you as you are too hip for that. Enjoy your root beer.
misterearl wrote:Absolutelyholfresh wrote:Results gents, results...Lets say u have a job where your boss gives u a budget to make 10 mil selling product X in a given year...U start out the gates burning rubber by making 7 mil in the first 3 months...Next nine months u make 4 mil..So your pace slowed but u made budget...The boss should fire you because u didn't keep up the pace no one expected u to produce profit at in the first place???..U guys kidding me???
the criteria for excellence just got raised. Nationally televised games? 50 wins? Eastern Conference contender? A championship in his first season?
The world is not enough.
rick carlisle was fired after b2b 50 win seasons in detroit, doug collins got smoked after reaching the ecf with the bulls. may be some behind the scenes or even open issues with those situations that lead to those moves, however, can anyone be surprised if the knicks went a diff direction next year?
cant say i would be shocked if he stays or goes. they make a decent playoff run, you would figure that ends the talk for a bit... you would figure...
Equal Time
VCoug wrote:misterearl wrote:Knicksfan - read the post again. In your haste to defend yourself, you missed the point entirely.Nor did your rebuttal hold any root beer.
Dude, the only point you made was a straw man. Instead of responding to points made by Knicksfan and others in this thread you reach back to some ridiculous point that you claim someone else made months ago to create a false equivalence between the complaints. If you have no problem with the lineups, the minute distribution, and the play-calling, especially at the end of games, then SAY THAT. But your straw man arguments only derail threads and don't move the discussion forward any.
VCoug - your post just moved the discussion forward?
You gets no points for trying to pile on. The tackle was already made via an excellent rebuttal by knicksfan.
Have a day.
sidsanders wrote:misterearl wrote:Absolutelyholfresh wrote:Results gents, results...Lets say u have a job where your boss gives u a budget to make 10 mil selling product X in a given year...U start out the gates burning rubber by making 7 mil in the first 3 months...Next nine months u make 4 mil..So your pace slowed but u made budget...The boss should fire you because u didn't keep up the pace no one expected u to produce profit at in the first place???..U guys kidding me???
the criteria for excellence just got raised. Nationally televised games? 50 wins? Eastern Conference contender? A championship in his first season?
The world is not enough.
rick carlisle was fired after b2b 50 win seasons in detroit, doug collins got smoked after reaching the ecf with the bulls. may be some behind the scenes or even open issues with those situations that lead to those moves, however, can anyone be surprised if the knicks went a diff direction next year?
cant say i would be shocked if he stays or goes. they make a decent playoff run, you would figure that ends the talk for a bit... you would figure...
With Carlisle I read that he rubbed his players the wrong way despite his record with his last two teams before joining the Mavs. He seemed to have learned his lesson and became better at managing personalities. I don't believe that's the case so much with Woodson.
All I care about is what kind of job Woodson does in the playoffs. Regular season wins are important but they don't mean anything if the coach doesn't step up his game while telling his players to do likewise.
If Woodson does a good job of coaching in the playoffs, making adjustments, timely substitutions, then he should be brought back, even if they don't go deep. If he has another subpar performance in the playoffs then I'd like to see who else is out there. If they can't find someone they believe can take them further then they should let Woodson stay.
Who ever thinks woodsons is better then MDA is sleep walking..woodson hand pick this roster.
Im sure Lin and nash and felton would be here..melo and MDA would have had iron everything out over the summer and we would have been somewhere around 45 wins thus far..
melo looked great during the olympics under mda..
No to woodson
knicks1248 wrote:Who ever thinks woodsons is better then MDA is sleep walking..woodson hand pick this roster.Im sure Lin and nash and felton would be here..melo and MDA would have had iron everything out over the summer and we would have been somewhere around 45 wins thus far..
melo looked great during the olympics under mda..
No to woodson
isnt that used a bit much without the context he was also playing with the best guys around? he didnt/doesnt have that now. carmelo + dantoni coached knicks team had a result of 32-37, 0 playoff wins. not sure those 2 are a match outside of international competition.
too many if's to say what they might have done/been. heck, if lin doesnt blow up, dantoni might have been fired before he quit. who knows.
Crazy Talk
knicks1248 - melo looked great during the olympics under mda
hell, Kwame Brown would look great playing next to Durant and Kobe.
Mike D'Antoni has his hands full with the Lakers. Let it go.
Besides, Carmelo is questionable for Saturday against Utah. Let's put any coach on trial to win without his best player.
Playing one of the top 3 teams in the league to the wire, sans our brightest star, does not count.
sidsanders wrote:knicks1248 wrote:Who ever thinks woodsons is better then MDA is sleep walking..woodson hand pick this roster.Im sure Lin and nash and felton would be here..melo and MDA would have had iron everything out over the summer and we would have been somewhere around 45 wins thus far..
melo looked great during the olympics under mda..
No to woodson
isnt that used a bit much without the context he was also playing with the best guys around? he didnt/doesnt have that now. carmelo + dantoni coached knicks team had a result of 32-37, 0 playoff wins. not sure those 2 are a match outside of international competition.
too many if's to say what they might have done/been. heck, if lin doesnt blow up, dantoni might have been fired before he quit. who knows.
Not might have. Dantoni would have been fired if not for linsanity
Linsanity was at least an example of what the Knicks organization failed to do for him during his stint here. GET HIM A DECENT PG!!! MDA if probably one of the easiest coaches to build a team for. It's pretty clear what kind of team you need to put together. SO far no one has really done that for him since his days in PHX. We all know what kind of players thrive in his system and yet that was something this franchise failed to do. During Linsanity it happened by default and of course it wasn't the best team you could put together with Lin and mostly our scrubs, but they did show that if you actually follow the plan it can work, even with a less talented group. If Melo had bought in rather than resisted it could've worked. We would have a great offensive coach and Woodson still here to handle the D. The reason the Lakers have now gone 14-6 over the last 20 is due to Kobe fulfilling that roll that MDA tried to give Melo.
