Knicks · Knicks have reached out to Boston and Clippers about Melo (page 4)

CrushAlot wrote:^^^^Mannix said he thought that if the Celtics could add Melo they take Cleveland to 7 games in the playoffs.

Thanks CrushAlot. You hit in every point I was going to in that series of posts.

CrushAlot wrote:

joec32033 wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:

joec32033 wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

newyorker4ever wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

smackeddog wrote:

newyorker4ever wrote:

smackeddog wrote:

Andrew wrote:

smackeddog wrote:I would be furious if we get Crawford - his contract is awful.

1 more year after this, and could be flipped to a playoff team.

Hoops hype has him at 2 more seasons after this one at $14mil per!

The 3rd year is non-guaranteed though so just next year at just over $14 mil

I still don't like it, plus what do the clips do for guards? Think that leaves them with no SG

like I said in the other thread, he's not trying to trade melo to make the Knicks better, he's trying to dump him for anything available. The only thing he cares about is matching the $

That's what makes Phil so bad, he wants to gut another team, then make his own roster clumsy and dumb with 5 SG, 5 centers and 2 half ass sf...just pure stupidity

Ummmmmmmmm huh?? What the heck are you talking about? He wants to trade Melo to get out of the final two years and $54 million owed to him after this year so he can properly build this team around KP. How can anyone see anything wrong with that? It's not working with Melo if you haven't noticed over the last 7 years and we now have a few good young players so why not start the rebuild asap? The time for Melo to be the #1 guy on a team has passed him by so he now needs to be the #2 or maybe even #3 guy on the team if you want to be a winning team and we can't get those kind of players to come to New York so he needs to go so we can start the rebuild the right way. Melo isn't gonna bring back the kind of return he would of say 3/4 years ago so get what you can for him and there's no big hurry to trade him right now so you have time to work teams against each other since we have almost a month until the trade deadline and if we can get two or even three teams that want him then maybe we can get more for him then he's really worth.

The Daily News is saying that the Knicks might send him to la for Rivers, Crawford and Reddick. That isn't rebuilding, getting younger or getting better. It certainly isn't getting younger and building around KP. Phil wants Melo gone for some reason. He wanted Tyson, JR and Shump gone. He wanted them gone more than he wanted to improve the team. I thought those guys needed to go as well but what Phil got for them sucked. A take of Rivers, Craw and Reddick for Melo would be an awful trade.

exactly my point..

The only trade partner that makes sense that I read about was Boston (Crowder/Smart/1st). Another one that may make sense is Chicago if they want to buy into a championship next year (Trade Butler for Melo now, try to sign Paul in the off seasonn have Wade, Paul, and Melo together).

Neither proposed trade you suggested makes sense. That BKN pick and Crowder far outweigh any value Melo brings you and Jimmy Butler is a far superior player to Melo at this point- a superstar in his own right.

I didnt propose the Crowder deal. It is what I heard on several outlets. The Butler deal, I only mentioned the principles.

I heard Crowder, Smart, Amir Johnson and a first round pick that wasn't bks.

You guys do realize that anything you hear is just people that aren't even in the Knicks organization just doing what we do and making up trades right?? Not one single person outside of any of the teams that would be involved would have any idea at all what players the teams are talking about.

Melo for rivers,perice,reddick

PP retiring and JJ are UFA after this year this opens up a lot of $ for the off season. We can go after a top FA this off season and if we tank we can get a top 5 pick.

KP,Noah
Willy,KOQ
Kuz,Lee,PP
JJ,rivers,holiday
Rose,Jennings,Rivers

It's a fresh start to truly build around KP next year and rivers is a solid young player

Next year rose, Jennings, JJ, PP all off the books

2018

KP,Noah
Willy,KOQ
Kuz,Lee
Rivers,holiday,baker
top 5 pick,baker

TripleThreat wrote:

smackeddog wrote:I would be furious if we get Crawford - his contract is awful. Reddick said he didn't like ny last time he was traded but you could pass him on to another team for a pick (he's expiring). Rivers is not worth taking on Crawford for. Awful trade.

I'm happy with any Boston deal- picks or players I'd be happy with either.

Then you better plan to be furious.

Knicks have zero leverage. Melo will only waive his NTC to go to a large market with "branding" opportunities, a chance to win and to get all his money with the trade kicker. The NTC is bad enough, the trade kicker is brutal.

Melo can say No and sulk until Jackson has no choice but to move him for pennies on the dollar to the Clippers.

Knicks can little now, or wait until Melo sulks and tries to poison the lockerroom to get out, in which case the Knicks little leverage weakens and they get even less.

Pennies on the dollar, the Knicks are not getting good assets here in return. They don't have the leverage to do so. The ONLY thing the Knicks have in their favor is the deadline itself. If not by then, a team hoping to push hard will have lost their best opportunity. That's it, that's all the Knicks have, a crunch against time working for them.

If the Knicks wait until the offseason, they risk Melo getting hurt ( and his trade value goes to zero) and he'll be a little bit older and teams will consider FA instead of a trade.

Trading him now for 25 cents on the dollar is better than trading him at the deadline for 15 cents on the dollar which is better than trading him in the offseason for about 8 cents on the dollar.

Knicks will have to bit the bullet and take in at least one bad contract.

Crawford can be flipped for a pick, most likely. I bet Philadelphia wouldn't say no to having a veteran shooter for their young bigs, for example. Remember they tried to sign Manu Ginobili to a 2-year $30M deal last summer. They'd surely take Crawford.

I think the Clippers are the team to aim for. Maybe try to get them to acquire a first round pick from another team to sweeten the pot.

But the Clippers are going to be super desperate to make one last run with CP3 before he hits FA. Also, Melo makes perfect sense for that team. You might argue he's the player they've been missing for the past few years.

Clippers makes too much sense to me and always has.

I'd be curious if the Knicks could involve DRose to a third team and then get Blake out of the deal. I think Blake/KP would be a great pair going forward and worth taking a year or two to figure out how to build around correctly.

But even if Blake can't be involved... I think the Clippers are the most likely spot for Melo - because of LA, the CP3 relationship, and most importantly he'd just be a perfect basketball fit for that team, moreso than anywhere else.

fitzfarm wrote:This is the trade the knicks should go for with the clips

Melo for rivers,perice,reddick

PP retiring and JJ are UFA after this year this opens up a lot of $ for the off season. We can go after a top FA this off season and if we tank we can get a top 5 pick.

KP,Noah
Willy,KOQ
Kuz,Lee,PP
JJ,rivers,holiday
Rose,Jennings,Rivers

It's a fresh start to truly build around KP next year and rivers is a solid young player

Next year rose, Jennings, JJ, PP all off the books

2018

KP,Noah
Willy,KOQ
Kuz,Lee
Rivers,holiday,baker
top 5 pick,baker

They go in on the Celtics being interested at the start.

wargames wrote:https://m.soundcloud.com/ringernbashow/ep-65-melo-trade-talk-with-chris-mannix

They go in on the Celtics being interested at the start.

CrushAlot wrote:

fitzfarm wrote:This is the trade the knicks should go for with the clips

Melo for rivers,perice,reddick

PP retiring and JJ are UFA after this year this opens up a lot of $ for the off season. We can go after a top FA this off season and if we tank we can get a top 5 pick.

KP,Noah
Willy,KOQ
Kuz,Lee,PP
JJ,rivers,holiday
Rose,Jennings,Rivers

It's a fresh start to truly build around KP next year and rivers is a solid young player

Next year rose, Jennings, JJ, PP all off the books

2018

KP,Noah
Willy,KOQ
Kuz,Lee
Rivers,holiday,baker
top 5 pick,baker

I don't think the Knicks are attracting any marquee free agents the way this has been handled. The marquee guys don't leave anyway. Look at what happened to the Nets. I don't know what this looks like but if Phil comes away with the proposed Clip package only Dolan should fire him on the spot.

Let's not forget this gives KP the rains and gives us the ability to run the offense through him not melo ... this turns KP into the super star we all know he is . He will make everyone around him better, he's a 7'3 monster no one can stop top FA will want to team up with KP more so then melo.

fitzfarm wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

fitzfarm wrote:This is the trade the knicks should go for with the clips

Melo for rivers,perice,reddick

PP retiring and JJ are UFA after this year this opens up a lot of $ for the off season. We can go after a top FA this off season and if we tank we can get a top 5 pick.

KP,Noah
Willy,KOQ
Kuz,Lee,PP
JJ,rivers,holiday
Rose,Jennings,Rivers

It's a fresh start to truly build around KP next year and rivers is a solid young player

Next year rose, Jennings, JJ, PP all off the books

2018

KP,Noah
Willy,KOQ
Kuz,Lee
Rivers,holiday,baker
top 5 pick,baker

I don't think the Knicks are attracting any marquee free agents the way this has been handled. The marquee guys don't leave anyway. Look at what happened to the Nets. I don't know what this looks like but if Phil comes away with the proposed Clip package only Dolan should fire him on the spot.

Let's not forget this gives KP the rains and gives us the ability to run the offense through him not melo ... this turns KP into the super star we all know he is . He will make everyone around him better, he's a 7'3 monster no one can stop top FA will want to team up with KP more so then melo.

Anthony to the Clips.

Blake and Pierce to the Lakers. Thomas to Lakers.

Deng and Clarkson to NYK - NY gets better of NY or LA first rounder

CrushAlot wrote:Phil is the one that wants him to go. Phil is the one that gave him the ntc and the trade kicker. But if Phil moves him for a package like it would be horrible. Reports are that Phil wants to get younger and build around KP. He would be adding a player four years older than Melo and another the exact same age. Also, the Clippers don't have picks to trade. There is no reason to do that deal for the Knicks.

You are operating under the belief that the Knicks have any trade leverage at all besides the actual trade deadline itself.

If you want to believe that, have at it. It's one way to see it ( Unlike many others on this site, I'm open to the idea that others have their view and its OK, even if it's different)

I don't see it that way.

This is not about if the Clippers have what the Knicks WANT in a trade. If Melo will only waive his NTC for the Clippers, and he's not going to a gutted team, then the best the Knicks can do is salvage "addition by subtraction" and hope the cap hits are short lived for them to get Melo off the roster.

When your list of teams reduces to 1, it changes everything. I don't think people see this here because Dolan insanely bid against himself when Melo wanted to come here from Denver, when the Knicks really had all the leverage ( it's NY or nowhere or lose Melo for nothing in FA for Denver)

The Knicks will not get Blake Griffin in a trade for Melo. It will not happen. Why? When the Clippers would have all the trade leverage? Now the Clippers might trade Griffin AFTER getting Melo to another team for other assets, but why would they give up the younger superstar player?

The Clippers need WING PLAYERS. Melo is a PF. Griffin is a PF. Griffin cannot play center, he has the athleticism ( he's off the charts) to defend the rim, but none of the instincts or timing or saavy to do it. You are also asking the Clippers to trade Doc Rivers son in this deal. Would they? ( People are irrational about their children, consider Dave Duncan, one of the best pitching coaches in baseball history, maybe of all time, went insane over how the Cardinals treated or did not treat his son in the organizational minors. You'll see superstar player have their "brothers" in the same team, just to keep that superstar happy. I think Bryce Harper or Stephen Strasburg has a brother in the same organization, you think it's because the kid is a massive talent like his brother?)

This is NOT about what the Knicks want, this is about what they can reasonably get given the circumstances. The circumstances IMHO dictate not much at all.

But if people want to see it different, that's up to them.

fwk00 wrote:Well Anthony to the Clips is possible in a scenario such as this.

Anthony to the Clips.

Blake and Pierce to the Lakers. Thomas to Lakers.

Deng and Clarkson to NYK - NY gets better of NY or LA first rounder

LA will only have a 1st rounder if its top 3. I doubt they do that. Also why do we want Deng?

TripleThreat wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:Phil is the one that wants him to go. Phil is the one that gave him the ntc and the trade kicker. But if Phil moves him for a package like it would be horrible. Reports are that Phil wants to get younger and build around KP. He would be adding a player four years older than Melo and another the exact same age. Also, the Clippers don't have picks to trade. There is no reason to do that deal for the Knicks.

You are operating under the belief that the Knicks have any trade leverage at all besides the actual trade deadline itself.

If you want to believe that, have at it. It's one way to see it ( Unlike many others on this site, I'm open to the idea that others have their view and its OK, even if it's different)

I don't see it that way.

This is not about if the Clippers have what the Knicks WANT in a trade. If Melo will only waive his NTC for the Clippers, and he's not going to a gutted team, then the best the Knicks can do is salvage "addition by subtraction" and hope the cap hits are short lived for them to get Melo off the roster.

When your list of teams reduces to 1, it changes everything. I don't think people see this here because Dolan insanely bid against himself when Melo wanted to come here from Denver, when the Knicks really had all the leverage ( it's NY or nowhere or lose Melo for nothing in FA for Denver)

The Knicks will not get Blake Griffin in a trade for Melo. It will not happen. Why? When the Clippers would have all the trade leverage? Now the Clippers might trade Griffin AFTER getting Melo to another team for other assets, but why would they give up the younger superstar player?

The Clippers need WING PLAYERS. Melo is a PF. Griffin is a PF. Griffin cannot play center, he has the athleticism ( he's off the charts) to defend the rim, but none of the instincts or timing or saavy to do it. You are also asking the Clippers to trade Doc Rivers son in this deal. Would they? ( People are irrational about their children, consider Dave Duncan, one of the best pitching coaches in baseball history, maybe of all time, went insane over how the Cardinals treated or did not treat his son in the organizational minors. You'll see superstar player have their "brothers" in the same team, just to keep that superstar happy. I think Bryce Harper or Stephen Strasburg has a brother in the same organization, you think it's because the kid is a massive talent like his brother?)

This is NOT about what the Knicks want, this is about what they can reasonably get given the circumstances. The circumstances IMHO dictate not much at all.

But if people want to see it different, that's up to them.

Yeah, I'm not buying that trade scenario at all. First, Rivers is terrible so the idea that he's a cornerstone of the deal is IMO insane. He adds zero to the Knicks. Crawford is fine but again not a fit here.

If the Clips and NY are in talks then a third team will have to be involved. And I agree, the Knicks can easily get short-changed in terms of talent but sometimes addition by subtraction is enough.

BRIGGS wrote:

fwk00 wrote:Well Anthony to the Clips is possible in a scenario such as this.

Anthony to the Clips.

Blake and Pierce to the Lakers. Thomas to Lakers.

Deng and Clarkson to NYK - NY gets better of NY or LA first rounder

LA will only have a 1st rounder if its top 3. I doubt they do that. Also why do we want Deng?

Knicks don't want Deng. Clarkson and the pick are the prize. Deng is a fiscal albatross is why they'd do the trade plus they get Griffin for all that's worth. Deng simply offsets what we are already in the tank for.

Mostly I just threw out a doable if implausible example of how a Clips trade might transpire.

nixluva wrote:Knicks are not desperate as it's being portrayed. They have picks and will be in this draft whether they trade Melo or not. There is no pressure to make a bad deal. Phil doesn't have to do a thing and he's gonna end up in the lottery unless there's a miraculous turnaround.

Not desperate but I think for the sake of public consumption, they need to clean house a bit. Eliminating a lightning rod or two always makes life easier.

fwk00 wrote:

nixluva wrote:Knicks are not desperate as it's being portrayed. They have picks and will be in this draft whether they trade Melo or not. There is no pressure to make a bad deal. Phil doesn't have to do a thing and he's gonna end up in the lottery unless there's a miraculous turnaround.

Not desperate but I think for the sake of public consumption, they need to clean house a bit. Eliminating a lightning rod or two always makes life easier.

Problem is what he has to take back. This is a tricky move to pull off. If he can't get a young talent or pick it makes little sense. I think Phil is gonna be more shrewd than some believe.

If not not then roll Melo at the 4 and move on

fwk00 wrote:

TripleThreat wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:Phil is the one that wants him to go. Phil is the one that gave him the ntc and the trade kicker. But if Phil moves him for a package like it would be horrible. Reports are that Phil wants to get younger and build around KP. He would be adding a player four years older than Melo and another the exact same age. Also, the Clippers don't have picks to trade. There is no reason to do that deal for the Knicks.

You are operating under the belief that the Knicks have any trade leverage at all besides the actual trade deadline itself.

If you want to believe that, have at it. It's one way to see it ( Unlike many others on this site, I'm open to the idea that others have their view and its OK, even if it's different)

I don't see it that way.

This is not about if the Clippers have what the Knicks WANT in a trade. If Melo will only waive his NTC for the Clippers, and he's not going to a gutted team, then the best the Knicks can do is salvage "addition by subtraction" and hope the cap hits are short lived for them to get Melo off the roster.

When your list of teams reduces to 1, it changes everything. I don't think people see this here because Dolan insanely bid against himself when Melo wanted to come here from Denver, when the Knicks really had all the leverage ( it's NY or nowhere or lose Melo for nothing in FA for Denver)

The Knicks will not get Blake Griffin in a trade for Melo. It will not happen. Why? When the Clippers would have all the trade leverage? Now the Clippers might trade Griffin AFTER getting Melo to another team for other assets, but why would they give up the younger superstar player?

The Clippers need WING PLAYERS. Melo is a PF. Griffin is a PF. Griffin cannot play center, he has the athleticism ( he's off the charts) to defend the rim, but none of the instincts or timing or saavy to do it. You are also asking the Clippers to trade Doc Rivers son in this deal. Would they? ( People are irrational about their children, consider Dave Duncan, one of the best pitching coaches in baseball history, maybe of all time, went insane over how the Cardinals treated or did not treat his son in the organizational minors. You'll see superstar player have their "brothers" in the same team, just to keep that superstar happy. I think Bryce Harper or Stephen Strasburg has a brother in the same organization, you think it's because the kid is a massive talent like his brother?)

This is NOT about what the Knicks want, this is about what they can reasonably get given the circumstances. The circumstances IMHO dictate not much at all.

But if people want to see it different, that's up to them.

Yeah, I'm not buying that trade scenario at all. First, Rivers is terrible so the idea that he's a cornerstone of the deal is IMO insane. He adds zero to the Knicks. Crawford is fine but again not a fit here.

If the Clips and NY are in talks then a third team will have to be involved. And I agree, the Knicks can easily get short-changed in terms of talent but sometimes addition by subtraction is enough.

Actually Rivers has been very good. He's been starting and averaging 18 ppg in the last 14. He also competes defensively. He's really improving. He's a good young player.

CrushAlot wrote:

fitzfarm wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

fitzfarm wrote:This is the trade the knicks should go for with the clips

Melo for rivers,perice,reddick

PP retiring and JJ are UFA after this year this opens up a lot of $ for the off season. We can go after a top FA this off season and if we tank we can get a top 5 pick.

KP,Noah
Willy,KOQ
Kuz,Lee,PP
JJ,rivers,holiday
Rose,Jennings,Rivers

It's a fresh start to truly build around KP next year and rivers is a solid young player

Next year rose, Jennings, JJ, PP all off the books

2018

KP,Noah
Willy,KOQ
Kuz,Lee
Rivers,holiday,baker
top 5 pick,baker

I don't think the Knicks are attracting any marquee free agents the way this has been handled. The marquee guys don't leave anyway. Look at what happened to the Nets. I don't know what this looks like but if Phil comes away with the proposed Clip package only Dolan should fire him on the spot.

Let's not forget this gives KP the rains and gives us the ability to run the offense through him not melo ... this turns KP into the super star we all know he is . He will make everyone around him better, he's a 7'3 monster no one can stop top FA will want to team up with KP more so then melo.

He is having a horrible run right now and it has been for awhile. His shooting, d, rebounding etc has been really bad. He also can't set a screen so moving him to the 5 doesn't work. He has the potential to be that guy eventually but I think he needs to be the second or third guy on a team at this point.

Knixkik wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

fitzfarm wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

fitzfarm wrote:This is the trade the knicks should go for with the clips

Melo for rivers,perice,reddick

PP retiring and JJ are UFA after this year this opens up a lot of $ for the off season. We can go after a top FA this off season and if we tank we can get a top 5 pick.

KP,Noah
Willy,KOQ
Kuz,Lee,PP
JJ,rivers,holiday
Rose,Jennings,Rivers

It's a fresh start to truly build around KP next year and rivers is a solid young player

Next year rose, Jennings, JJ, PP all off the books

2018

KP,Noah
Willy,KOQ
Kuz,Lee
Rivers,holiday,baker
top 5 pick,baker

I don't think the Knicks are attracting any marquee free agents the way this has been handled. The marquee guys don't leave anyway. Look at what happened to the Nets. I don't know what this looks like but if Phil comes away with the proposed Clip package only Dolan should fire him on the spot.

Let's not forget this gives KP the rains and gives us the ability to run the offense through him not melo ... this turns KP into the super star we all know he is . He will make everyone around him better, he's a 7'3 monster no one can stop top FA will want to team up with KP more so then melo.

He is having a horrible run right now and it has been for awhile. His shooting, d, rebounding etc has been really bad. He also can't set a screen so moving him to the 5 doesn't work. He has the potential to be that guy eventually but I think he needs to be the second or third guy on a team at this point.

All young guys aren't ready to lead but they learn on the fly. We will be bad but that's ok. He's not playing well but it has been because of injury so we know he will turn it back around soon. Amazing how down people are on him. He was putting up big numbers before he got hurt.

Yes 100% agree, I think KP flourishes as the go to guy. He's looks depressed playing second/third fiddle to melo and rose sometimes only taking 11 shots!!! What the f u c k KP should be dominant taking at least 15 plus shots a game he should be our go to guy not melo. Some times he doesn't even take a shot till the second quarter. WHAT ! Sometimes we don't run a play for KP for most of the game WHAT ??! KP has the potential to be the greatest knick of all time. Like Tim Duncan was to the spurs KP should be for the knicks .. the fact that we have such a dominant talent as KP and we don't run the offense through him is a travesty. Melo is a star talent but by all means at best is a second/maybe third option on a real offense esp a offense that has a supior talent to him in KP and even rose has more talent then melo...melo ether has to except that he's not the main man anymore or be ok with being traded because melo as option number one dose not work it hasn't for years ...... this is KP's team melo get in line or get the f u c k outta New York .