I'm starting to become Bullish on IQ as our starter. But a healthy D Rose next year, maybe our starting PG. If thibs has anything to say about that. Unless we bring in a high profile player, hard to see Thibs start IQ over Rose. I'm still bullish on Deuce, as a rotational player for now. IQ's PG development seems to be improving. But I'm glad Deuce is getting real minutes. This will make next year a breeze. Iron out all the nerves now, and come back next season ready.
blkexec wrote:I'm starting to become Bullish on IQ as our starter. But a healthy D Rose next year, maybe our starting PG. If thibs has anything to say about that. Unless we bring in a high profile player, hard to see Thibs start IQ over Rose. I'm still bullish on Deuce, as a rotational player for now. IQ's PG development seems to be improving. But I'm glad Deuce is getting real minutes. This will make next year a breeze. Iron out all the nerves now, and come back next season ready.
I would fine with going into next season with a PG depth of Rose/IQ/McBride (please no Burks!
)
You KNOW whoever plays behind Rose is going to get a lot of a minutes. He's not going to stay on the court, but he could be a good tone setter.
PGs take time and some of the best took a LOT of time. Go look at Kyle Lowry and Steve Nash... those guys took a few years before they got it and a few more to get really good but damn they got really good.
IQ plays really hard and the coaches love him. This kid is a gem and could very well be the PG of our future. As for McBride he's got a lot to prove but his floor and ceiling are getting higher and higher all the time 
The perfect UK replacement for the Frank lovers.
Low expectation 2nd rounder.
Shoots terribly, but at least isn't afraid to shoot. Yet.
The D is there, literally.
Better nickname.
jrodmc wrote:The perfect UK replacement for the Frank lovers.
Low expectation 2nd rounder.
Shoots terribly, but at least isn't afraid to shoot. Yet.
The D is there, literally.
Better nickname.
He's just got the Obi jitters, he'll be a good shooter eventually
martin wrote:jrodmc wrote:The perfect UK replacement for the Frank lovers.
Low expectation 2nd rounder.
Shoots terribly, but at least isn't afraid to shoot. Yet.
The D is there, literally.
Better nickname.
He's just got the Obi jitters, he'll be a good shooter eventually
And he's not DSJr.
And he doesn't run like Shaggy-Obi.
How come Grimes didn't have to wait for "eventually"?
jrodmc wrote:martin wrote:jrodmc wrote:The perfect UK replacement for the Frank lovers.
Low expectation 2nd rounder.
Shoots terribly, but at least isn't afraid to shoot. Yet.
The D is there, literally.
Better nickname.
He's just got the Obi jitters, he'll be a good shooter eventually
And he's not DSJr.
And he doesn't run like Shaggy-Obi.
How come Grimes didn't have to wait for "eventually"?
But Shaggy-Obi is how he gets up and down the court so fast! You say it like it's a bad thing!
jrodmc wrote:martin wrote:jrodmc wrote:The perfect UK replacement for the Frank lovers.
Low expectation 2nd rounder.
Shoots terribly, but at least isn't afraid to shoot. Yet.
The D is there, literally.
Better nickname.
He's just got the Obi jitters, he'll be a good shooter eventually
And he's not DSJr.
And he doesn't run like Shaggy-Obi.
How come Grimes didn't have to wait for "eventually"?
Grimes was projected higher than Deuce.
Grimes was known for his offense (eventhough hes a 2way player), Deuce was known for his defense.
To be honest, I was shocked at his offense in the gleague. Especially his 3 pt shot. Seems like offense came on late for Deuce and with Grimes, he comes across as a scorer from day one. I believe in the predraft full court game, Grimes was the one who stood out. When he gets hot, he gets real hot and keeps shooting. Thats the Allan Houston comparison to me. But Grimes defense is underrated.
Rose\IQ\Deuce
Grimes \ EF
RJ\Cam
Randle \ Obi
(Starter)\ Sims
blkexec wrote:jrodmc wrote:martin wrote:jrodmc wrote:The perfect UK replacement for the Frank lovers.
Low expectation 2nd rounder.
Shoots terribly, but at least isn't afraid to shoot. Yet.
The D is there, literally.
Better nickname.
He's just got the Obi jitters, he'll be a good shooter eventually
And he's not DSJr.
And he doesn't run like Shaggy-Obi.
How come Grimes didn't have to wait for "eventually"?
Grimes was projected higher than Deuce.
Grimes was known for his offense (eventhough hes a 2way player), Deuce was known for his defense.
To be honest, I was shocked at his offense in the gleague. Especially his 3 pt shot. Seems like offense came on late for Deuce and with Grimes, he comes across as a scorer from day one. I believe in the predraft full court game, Grimes was the one who stood out. When he gets hot, he gets real hot and keeps shooting. Thats the Allan Houston comparison to me. But Grimes defense is underrated.
Rose\IQ\Deuce
Grimes \ EF
RJ\Cam
Randle \ Obi
(Starter)\ Sims
*How can I forget our current starting PG in Burks (lol). We have way too many average - good players and not enough good - great players.
jrodmc wrote:martin wrote:jrodmc wrote:The perfect UK replacement for the Frank lovers.
Low expectation 2nd rounder.
Shoots terribly, but at least isn't afraid to shoot. Yet.
The D is there, literally.
Better nickname.
He's just got the Obi jitters, he'll be a good shooter eventually
And he's not DSJr.
And he doesn't run like Shaggy-Obi.
How come Grimes didn't have to wait for "eventually"?
Short term memory is a hell of a thing. They have McBride running Frank sets under Fizdale. Raises what is McBride thinking getting back to back assists on three point by Obi. Doesn’t he know that is an automatic move to the bench.
blkexec wrote:I'm starting to become Bullish on IQ as our starter. But a healthy D Rose next year, maybe our starting PG. If thibs has anything to say about that. Unless we bring in a high profile player, hard to see Thibs start IQ over Rose. I'm still bullish on Deuce, as a rotational player for now. IQ's PG development seems to be improving. But I'm glad Deuce is getting real minutes. This will make next year a breeze. Iron out all the nerves now, and come back next season ready.
The Knicks starter PG problem? How long has it been?
D.Rose are a 24 minute win-win 6th Man! not a 30 or 40+ minute player.
And 2nd season combo-guard Quickley deserve to play alongside a vet PG his first 3 seasons in the NBA, to improvs his two-position craft.
The Knicks FO has batted 0-3 (Payton, Rivers, Kemba) the past 3 seasons at getting the Knicks a decent PG in the offseason.
In the 2021 offseason their were several decent FA starter PG available for the Knicks FO to fix and solve the Knicks number-one problem. Signing Kyle Lowry or Dinwiddie, then signing Kemba's knees, and resigning D.Rose the Knicks would probably be a 4th to 6th seed team today.
I have never been the best at explaining myself but I ended up coming across a thread from sports writer from about a month ago where the person pretty much explains my exact problem with how Thibs handles the team and why I ended up thinking having Thibs is doing more harm than good.
With that being said I think I am just going to talk about how the team is playing. I think my disappointment in the team has gotten me to be more negative than I usually like with sports. Usually by this time when the Knicks stink I ignore them and check back in for the draft. I think my belief in the young players on this team has kept me around longer than normal. I truly believe if put in the right position every one of our young players including Sims can contribute to winning basketball. I just don't think Thibs is the coach to put them in the right position to succeed. With that being said I would like to apologize about my negativity. I want to be clear my stances on the players, coaches and tactics are what I truly believe and stick by them but if I have been overly negative with anyone in expressing those beliefs this apology is to you.
Here is KD talking about Ja's development but it could also be applies to all young PGs.
Writers will feed the frustration and direct blame. Its their job.
YOung players are either held back or they are not ready to step up. Ja had way more upside than Deuce. We can’t begin to compare.
RJ was on the court day one but was not ready to have the keys. I don’t see that he was held back.
IQ was given great opportunity as a rookie, but to give him more time he needed playmaking and that took time.
I have watched more hoop this season than any other in the last 10 years and I don’t have issue with how Thibs played the yoot.
Im not saying his coaching as stellar this year but hindsight does make us all smarter.
That he got Randle back on track, or how ever it happend was good! No knee jerk trades or exile.
Thibs told us day one that injuries would happen and the kids would get opportunities. He was correct and he got them ready.
ITs very open to interpretation does the chicken or the egg come first.
Nalod wrote:Writers will feed the frustration and direct blame. Its their job.YOung players are either held back or they are not ready to step up. Ja had way more upside than Deuce. We can’t begin to compare.
RJ was on the court day one but was not ready to have the keys. I don’t see that he was held back.
IQ was given great opportunity as a rookie, but to give him more time he needed playmaking and that took time.
I have watched more hoop this season than any other in the last 10 years and I don’t have issue with how Thibs played the yoot.
Im not saying his coaching as stellar this year but hindsight does make us all smarter.
That he got Randle back on track, or how ever it happend was good! No knee jerk trades or exile.
Thibs told us day one that injuries would happen and the kids would get opportunities. He was correct and he got them ready.
ITs very open to interpretation does the chicken or the egg come first.
First it sounds like you disagree about thibs not playing the rookies but the one line you mentioned about thibs seems to align with clean. Thibs only plays rookies if he has no choice, like injuries. So if there was no injuries, we would talk about grimes like we talk about deuce. And the thib supporters will say, grimes not ready. It’s against the gleague. It’s not the nba. If he can play thibs would play him.
Grimes would’ve went to the gleague and killed it like deuce. And we will say, since thibs not playing him he must not be ready 🤣.
I would understand your argument if you said thibs can only do what the FO allows him to do. But tye lue for example is on record saying he would play whoever, if they can contribute. Lue and other coaches are more flexible than thibs. Thibs seems to make moves that was job safe this season. Playing the worse starting 5 all season didn’t make since to me. When the results was not there and clearly the bench out played the starters all season.
jrodmc wrote:The perfect UK replacement for the Frank lovers.
Low expectation 2nd rounder.
Shoots terribly, but at least isn't afraid to shoot. Yet.
The D is there, literally.
Better nickname.
Having a difficult time understanding why you keep tying Deuce to Frank. Completely different expectations between a lottery pick and 2nd rounder. Reason for extended Deuce discussion is Knicks losing and PG ineffectiveness / injuries. As much as you seem to love seeing Burks out there running the point....many of us want to see what more of what Deuce can do (or not do) in extended minutes for what essentially is a lost season. As a rookie Frank got his chance by averaging 22 minutes per game over 78 games played. To date Deuce has played 29 games averaging 8.4 mpg. Not really comparable on that front either.
foosballnick wrote:jrodmc wrote:The perfect UK replacement for the Frank lovers.
Low expectation 2nd rounder.
Shoots terribly, but at least isn't afraid to shoot. Yet.
The D is there, literally.
Better nickname.
Having a difficult time understanding why you keep tying Deuce to Frank. Completely different expectations between a lottery pick and 2nd rounder. Reason for extended Deuce discussion is Knicks losing and PG ineffectiveness / injuries. As much as you seem to love seeing Burks out there running the point....many of us want to see what more of what Deuce can do (or not do) in extended minutes for what essentially is a lost season. As a rookie Frank got his chance by averaging 22 minutes per game over 78 games played. To date Deuce has played 29 games averaging 8.4 mpg. Not really comparable on that front either.
I couldn’t have said it any better. Agree 1000%
foosballnick wrote:jrodmc wrote:The perfect UK replacement for the Frank lovers.
Low expectation 2nd rounder.
Shoots terribly, but at least isn't afraid to shoot. Yet.
The D is there, literally.
Better nickname.
Having a difficult time understanding why you keep tying Deuce to Frank. Completely different expectations between a lottery pick and 2nd rounder. Reason for extended Deuce discussion is Knicks losing and PG ineffectiveness / injuries. As much as you seem to love seeing Burks out there running the point....many of us want to see what more of what Deuce can do (or not do) in extended minutes for what essentially is a lost season. As a rookie Frank got his chance by averaging 22 minutes per game over 78 games played. To date Deuce has played 29 games averaging 8.4 mpg. Not really comparable on that front either.
Okay, I guess I should have put the smiley after the first line. Have you noticed this thread is already at 19 pages for a backup-backup-backup PG? That's the connection Deuce has to Frank. Thread page length. See how that worked?
Ummm...same discussion was involved with Frank, wasn't it? Knicks losing and PG issues? Or did we have a franchise PG in the last 4 years that I just missed seeing?
Never said I loved Burks running the point. Just doesn't seem to be a lot of options for Thibs at this point, is there? Playing McBride for extended periods just to appease the UK "many of us" is probably not high on Thibs' priority list for keeping his job. As a rookie Frank got multiple chances because of the equity invested in a #8 first round pick, as opposed to the nice new shiny second round thing burning up the Gleague. Grimes got his chance and is killing it, before getting hurt. Sims is getting burn now. I somehow continue to think that maybe, just maybe, Thibs knows much more than "many of us". Except for possibly TripleThreat. He knows more than God.
I get tired of reading all this "play the yoots because WEEEEE need to SEEEEEEE" sheehit.
jrodmc wrote:foosballnick wrote:jrodmc wrote:The perfect UK replacement for the Frank lovers.
Low expectation 2nd rounder.
Shoots terribly, but at least isn't afraid to shoot. Yet.
The D is there, literally.
Better nickname.
Having a difficult time understanding why you keep tying Deuce to Frank. Completely different expectations between a lottery pick and 2nd rounder. Reason for extended Deuce discussion is Knicks losing and PG ineffectiveness / injuries. As much as you seem to love seeing Burks out there running the point....many of us want to see what more of what Deuce can do (or not do) in extended minutes for what essentially is a lost season. As a rookie Frank got his chance by averaging 22 minutes per game over 78 games played. To date Deuce has played 29 games averaging 8.4 mpg. Not really comparable on that front either.
Okay, I guess I should have put the smiley after the first line. Have you noticed this thread is already at 19 pages for a backup-backup-backup PG? That's the connection Deuce has to Frank. Thread page length. See how that worked?
Ummm...same discussion was involved with Frank, wasn't it? Knicks losing and PG issues? Or did we have a franchise PG in the last 4 years that I just missed seeing?
Never said I loved Burks running the point. Just doesn't seem to be a lot of options for Thibs at this point, is there? Playing McBride for extended periods just to appease the UK "many of us" is probably not high on Thibs' priority list for keeping his job. As a rookie Frank got multiple chances because of the equity invested in a #8 first round pick, as opposed to the nice new shiny second round thing burning up the Gleague. Grimes got his chance and is killing it, before getting hurt. Sims is getting burn now. I somehow continue to think that maybe, just maybe, Thibs knows much more than "many of us". Except for possibly TripleThreat. He knows more than God.
I get tired of reading all this "play the yoots because WEEEEE need to SEEEEEEE" sheehit.
I’m sorry you are tired of hearing play the yoots. Just read a recent article where thibs agrees. So are you only tired of hearing it from fans like yourself, but not tired when u hear it from Thibs?
You as a fan should want to know what we have on the shelf no? Or do you just except what thibs does and say the problem is he must not have a choice? When choices are on the bench like grimes?
Thibs starting 5 was the longest lineup in the entire league. That starting 5 also had the worse plus minus. So is it thibs who doesn’t have a choice or Thibs stubbornness to inject a few changes? Especially when the rooks and sophomores brings the type of energy to beat good teams, yet the starting 5 couldnt beat bad teams.
Again, this is all water under the bridge. Thibs is on record saying this is development for the yoots time. Something I’ve been asking for and he’s finally coming around to it. And what do you know. Sims looks like a keeper. Playing yoots is not just for fans, but for thibs, the FO and the yoots.
If you not going to play deuce why draft him.
If you not going to play Obi, why draft him.
If you not going to play cam, why trade a first for him.
If thibs doesn’t like small old PGs, why pay Kemba.
If thibs doesn’t like defensively challenged guards, why pay Fournier.
