Knicks · [Game Thread 5/10/23] 2nd Round Game 5 DO OR DIE vs Heat 7:30PM TNT (page 18)

Clean @ 5/11/2023 3:46 PM
fishmike wrote:
Clean wrote:
Why even double this? Why double Bam at all. He will never score enough to beat us alone. Giving up open 3's is a staple of Thibs defense. We got lucky that they were missing last night. You think that will happen 2 more times?
really? Bam has destroyed our centers, and before last night Mitch was buying every pump fake. He's a stud and he's killed us

So let me get this straight. You would rather give up open 3's to a team that was the best 3pt shooting team coming into this series rather than have Bam who is averaging 17ppg have a one on one with Mitch? This is a difference in defensive philosophy. Bam is not a scorer that will carry his team. Their 3pt shooters can carry their teams to victory. I mean they did it vs the Buck and have made us pay this series. Bam will not be getting 50 pt games. So you live with whatever he does. If Mitch keeps biting on pump fakes you tell him not to go for blocks and just make his shot hard through positioning and verticality. The Heat are not like us. They are very willing passers. You double and they will find the open man every time. The only person on the Heat who should ever get doubled is Butler if he is going off on us.

Rookie @ 5/11/2023 5:00 PM
Clean wrote:
fishmike wrote:
Clean wrote:
Why even double this? Why double Bam at all. He will never score enough to beat us alone. Giving up open 3's is a staple of Thibs defense. We got lucky that they were missing last night. You think that will happen 2 more times?
really? Bam has destroyed our centers, and before last night Mitch was buying every pump fake. He's a stud and he's killed us

So let me get this straight. You would rather give up open 3's to a team that was the best 3pt shooting team coming into this series rather than have Bam who is averaging 17ppg have a one on one with Mitch? This is a difference in defensive philosophy. Bam is not a scorer that will carry his team. Their 3pt shooters can carry their teams to victory. I mean they did it vs the Buck and have made us pay this series. Bam will not be getting 50 pt games. So you live with whatever he does. If Mitch keeps biting on pump fakes you tell him not to go for blocks and just make his shot hard through positioning and verticality. The Heat are not like us. They are very willing passers. You double and they will find the open man every time. The only person on the Heat who should ever get doubled is Butler if he is going off on us.

We put two hard fouls on Love in the 1st Q. The second of which he came down hard and you could hear how hard he hit the floor. It could be his back. He didn’t make a shot after that. I always cringe when old dudes hit the floor hard, but not them fools on the Heat. Bam needs some splinters

martin @ 5/11/2023 5:20 PM
Clean wrote:
fishmike wrote:
Clean wrote:
Why even double this? Why double Bam at all. He will never score enough to beat us alone. Giving up open 3's is a staple of Thibs defense. We got lucky that they were missing last night. You think that will happen 2 more times?
really? Bam has destroyed our centers, and before last night Mitch was buying every pump fake. He's a stud and he's killed us

So let me get this straight. You would rather give up open 3's to a team that was the best 3pt shooting team coming into this series rather than have Bam who is averaging 17ppg have a one on one with Mitch? This is a difference in defensive philosophy. Bam is not a scorer that will carry his team. Their 3pt shooters can carry their teams to victory. I mean they did it vs the Buck and have made us pay this series. Bam will not be getting 50 pt games. So you live with whatever he does. If Mitch keeps biting on pump fakes you tell him not to go for blocks and just make his shot hard through positioning and verticality. The Heat are not like us. They are very willing passers. You double and they will find the open man every time. The only person on the Heat who should ever get doubled is Butler if he is going off on us.

You do understand that this can be less black and white than you are laying it out to be?

Bam is a very good from the mid range, that's his spot, and exactly where he was getting the ball.

For the game, Bam shoots 7-11 and most of his shots are within that vicinity and in. Also, in this particular game, Love is 0-6 from 3pt point land and he is shooting 33% from 3 for the season and during playoffs.

Randle maybe had a good idea but was kinda lazy on the close?

Maybe you want to live with a poor shooter instead of a guy who is doing really good work in exactly the spot he gets the ball? I get your concept but...?

Love is good but who labels a player who is shooting 33% from 3point land "too good a shooter"?

BigDaddyG @ 5/11/2023 6:21 PM
HofstraBBall wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:I crapped on him the past few days years so I should give him his due now.

Fixed.

This your baby brother?

We got a couple more games my friend.

Who needs a rap song when they have you.
Hofstra trying to hold it in when someone criticizes Randle.

Nah bro. All smiles after a dub. And Randle needs to improve a lot of things. Just like feeding those with the fever.

This you?


35,12 and 6? Those Randle's career playoff shooting percentages? Surprised you went there... You're going to make you're older brother Kyden mad.

Why so unhappy brah? We WON the game. He only had 24. And the Mcrib will be back in the summer?

Btw, for your reading pleasure.

https://www.nba.com/news/2022-23-all-nba...

Unhappy? I'm chillen. Everyone saw the game no need to defend your dad. Everyone is happy. But let me try something... Randle has been trash more often times than not in postseason. That stats back it up. Hofstra baseless rebuttal coming 3,2...

Lmao. Hit that next button on him being named all NBA.

The fever does not allow you to see that rational Knick fans have never touted his playoff production. Nor claimed he was a top elite number one.
Just that haters like to ignore his production as a Knick, relative decent cost and that we have NO ONE available for comparable value that is better at the PF spot. ,
They just bring up hater shit like yeah but he is not averaging 30 plus in the playoffs and has not won us a chip. Right after he gets his second All Star and All NBA nod.
And the Mcrib is not a Filet Mignon.

Don't worry bro, he will make several mistakes in the next game. Unlike any other player in the olayoffs. Just get the video recorder ready so you can play it on a loop on your TV.

That may all be true. Does it change the fact he has been Mr.Cheeks for most of his playoff career. Or are we going to digress again and bring up some long forgotten SEC accolades he received? Julius is top 10 PF, possibly even top 5. Does it mean we should overlook his obvious flaws?

Chandler @ 5/11/2023 6:32 PM
If you check all NBA voting who is better PF than Jules at the moment? Sabonis? Lebron if you put him there? He’s up there and with all his flaw he is pretty damn good “on balance”
foosballnick @ 5/11/2023 7:25 PM
BigDaddyG wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:I crapped on him the past few days years so I should give him his due now.

Fixed.

This your baby brother?

We got a couple more games my friend.

Who needs a rap song when they have you.
Hofstra trying to hold it in when someone criticizes Randle.

Nah bro. All smiles after a dub. And Randle needs to improve a lot of things. Just like feeding those with the fever.

This you?


35,12 and 6? Those Randle's career playoff shooting percentages? Surprised you went there... You're going to make you're older brother Kyden mad.

Why so unhappy brah? We WON the game. He only had 24. And the Mcrib will be back in the summer?

Btw, for your reading pleasure.

https://www.nba.com/news/2022-23-all-nba...

Unhappy? I'm chillen. Everyone saw the game no need to defend your dad. Everyone is happy. But let me try something... Randle has been trash more often times than not in postseason. That stats back it up. Hofstra baseless rebuttal coming 3,2...

Lmao. Hit that next button on him being named all NBA.

The fever does not allow you to see that rational Knick fans have never touted his playoff production. Nor claimed he was a top elite number one.
Just that haters like to ignore his production as a Knick, relative decent cost and that we have NO ONE available for comparable value that is better at the PF spot. ,
They just bring up hater shit like yeah but he is not averaging 30 plus in the playoffs and has not won us a chip. Right after he gets his second All Star and All NBA nod.
And the Mcrib is not a Filet Mignon.

Don't worry bro, he will make several mistakes in the next game. Unlike any other player in the olayoffs. Just get the video recorder ready so you can play it on a loop on your TV.

That may all be true. Does it change the fact he has been Mr.Cheeks for most of his playoff career. Or are we going to digress again and bring up some long forgotten SEC accolades he received? Julius is top 10 PF, possibly even top 5. Does it mean we should overlook his obvious flaws?

I'm no Randle cheerleader, but when it comes to the Knicks it seems like everything is so overblown (mostly to the negative) on fanboards, talk radio, ESPN, sports shows and fan forums. Randle and RJ have taken the brunt of it over the past couple years. Randle's "playoff career" consists of twice over the course of 14 games. 2 years ago the entire team blew chunks. Mostly due to the loss of Mitch coupled with the lack of any effective PG play. This year Randle is essentially playing with a not fully healed high ankle sprain. While he's obviously not Brunson in terms of leadership mentality - I think that many fans are being a bit unfair.

BigDaddyG @ 5/11/2023 7:44 PM
foosballnick wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:I crapped on him the past few days years so I should give him his due now.

Fixed.

This your baby brother?

We got a couple more games my friend.

Who needs a rap song when they have you.
Hofstra trying to hold it in when someone criticizes Randle.

Nah bro. All smiles after a dub. And Randle needs to improve a lot of things. Just like feeding those with the fever.

This you?


35,12 and 6? Those Randle's career playoff shooting percentages? Surprised you went there... You're going to make you're older brother Kyden mad.

Why so unhappy brah? We WON the game. He only had 24. And the Mcrib will be back in the summer?

Btw, for your reading pleasure.

https://www.nba.com/news/2022-23-all-nba...

Unhappy? I'm chillen. Everyone saw the game no need to defend your dad. Everyone is happy. But let me try something... Randle has been trash more often times than not in postseason. That stats back it up. Hofstra baseless rebuttal coming 3,2...

Lmao. Hit that next button on him being named all NBA.

The fever does not allow you to see that rational Knick fans have never touted his playoff production. Nor claimed he was a top elite number one.
Just that haters like to ignore his production as a Knick, relative decent cost and that we have NO ONE available for comparable value that is better at the PF spot. ,
They just bring up hater shit like yeah but he is not averaging 30 plus in the playoffs and has not won us a chip. Right after he gets his second All Star and All NBA nod.
And the Mcrib is not a Filet Mignon.

Don't worry bro, he will make several mistakes in the next game. Unlike any other player in the olayoffs. Just get the video recorder ready so you can play it on a loop on your TV.

That may all be true. Does it change the fact he has been Mr.Cheeks for most of his playoff career. Or are we going to digress again and bring up some long forgotten SEC accolades he received? Julius is top 10 PF, possibly even top 5. Does it mean we should overlook his obvious flaws?

I'm no Randle cheerleader, but when it comes to the Knicks it seems like everything is so overblown (mostly to the negative) on fanboards, talk radio, ESPN, sports shows and fan forums. Randle and RJ have taken the brunt of it over the past couple years. Randle's "playoff career" consists of twice over the course of 14 games. 2 years ago the entire team blew chunks. Mostly due to the loss of Mitch coupled with the lack of any effective PG play. This year Randle is essentially playing with a not fully healed high ankle sprain. While he's obviously not Brunson in terms of leadership mentality - I think that many fans are being a bit unfair.

Randle and RJ get questioned when they play bad and praised when they play well. That's as fair as it gets in the world of sports fandom. You play with crappy effort and you will get called out for it. Injuries happen. Sometimes you're shot is just off. It happens. The one thing anyone can control is their effort and Randle's effort was disgusting in game four. And that's sugar coating things. He bounced back and he's getting praise. Those are the facts. Nothing to with his character. Nothing to do with hate.

martin @ 5/11/2023 7:47 PM
BigDaddyG wrote:
foosballnick wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:I crapped on him the past few days years so I should give him his due now.

Fixed.

This your baby brother?

We got a couple more games my friend.

Who needs a rap song when they have you.
Hofstra trying to hold it in when someone criticizes Randle.

Nah bro. All smiles after a dub. And Randle needs to improve a lot of things. Just like feeding those with the fever.

This you?


35,12 and 6? Those Randle's career playoff shooting percentages? Surprised you went there... You're going to make you're older brother Kyden mad.

Why so unhappy brah? We WON the game. He only had 24. And the Mcrib will be back in the summer?

Btw, for your reading pleasure.

https://www.nba.com/news/2022-23-all-nba...

Unhappy? I'm chillen. Everyone saw the game no need to defend your dad. Everyone is happy. But let me try something... Randle has been trash more often times than not in postseason. That stats back it up. Hofstra baseless rebuttal coming 3,2...

Lmao. Hit that next button on him being named all NBA.

The fever does not allow you to see that rational Knick fans have never touted his playoff production. Nor claimed he was a top elite number one.
Just that haters like to ignore his production as a Knick, relative decent cost and that we have NO ONE available for comparable value that is better at the PF spot. ,
They just bring up hater shit like yeah but he is not averaging 30 plus in the playoffs and has not won us a chip. Right after he gets his second All Star and All NBA nod.
And the Mcrib is not a Filet Mignon.

Don't worry bro, he will make several mistakes in the next game. Unlike any other player in the olayoffs. Just get the video recorder ready so you can play it on a loop on your TV.

That may all be true. Does it change the fact he has been Mr.Cheeks for most of his playoff career. Or are we going to digress again and bring up some long forgotten SEC accolades he received? Julius is top 10 PF, possibly even top 5. Does it mean we should overlook his obvious flaws?

I'm no Randle cheerleader, but when it comes to the Knicks it seems like everything is so overblown (mostly to the negative) on fanboards, talk radio, ESPN, sports shows and fan forums. Randle and RJ have taken the brunt of it over the past couple years. Randle's "playoff career" consists of twice over the course of 14 games. 2 years ago the entire team blew chunks. Mostly due to the loss of Mitch coupled with the lack of any effective PG play. This year Randle is essentially playing with a not fully healed high ankle sprain. While he's obviously not Brunson in terms of leadership mentality - I think that many fans are being a bit unfair.

Randle and RJ get questioned when they play bad and praised when they play well. That's as fair as it gets in the world of sports fandom. You play with crappy effort and you will get called out for it. Injuries happen. Sometimes you're shot is just off. It happens. The one thing anyone can control is their effort and Randle's effort was disgusting in game four. And that's sugar coating things. He bounced back and he's getting praise. Those are the facts. Nothing to with his character. Nothing to do with hate.

All I read was TRADE RANDLE!!!

BigDaddyG @ 5/11/2023 8:20 PM
^^ Not for just anyone. I was thinking for someone like Trayce Davis Jackson.
KnickDanger @ 5/11/2023 8:45 PM
Let’s trade Randle, bench RJ, and fire Thibs all the way to the finals.
Clean @ 5/11/2023 9:52 PM
martin wrote:
Clean wrote:
fishmike wrote:
Clean wrote:
Why even double this? Why double Bam at all. He will never score enough to beat us alone. Giving up open 3's is a staple of Thibs defense. We got lucky that they were missing last night. You think that will happen 2 more times?
really? Bam has destroyed our centers, and before last night Mitch was buying every pump fake. He's a stud and he's killed us

So let me get this straight. You would rather give up open 3's to a team that was the best 3pt shooting team coming into this series rather than have Bam who is averaging 17ppg have a one on one with Mitch? This is a difference in defensive philosophy. Bam is not a scorer that will carry his team. Their 3pt shooters can carry their teams to victory. I mean they did it vs the Buck and have made us pay this series. Bam will not be getting 50 pt games. So you live with whatever he does. If Mitch keeps biting on pump fakes you tell him not to go for blocks and just make his shot hard through positioning and verticality. The Heat are not like us. They are very willing passers. You double and they will find the open man every time. The only person on the Heat who should ever get doubled is Butler if he is going off on us.

You do understand that this can be less black and white than you are laying it out to be?

Bam is a very good from the mid range, that's his spot, and exactly where he was getting the ball.

For the game, Bam shoots 7-11 and most of his shots are within that vicinity and in. Also, in this particular game, Love is 0-6 from 3pt point land and he is shooting 33% from 3 for the season and during playoffs.

Randle maybe had a good idea but was kinda lazy on the close?

Maybe you want to live with a poor shooter instead of a guy who is doing really good work in exactly the spot he gets the ball? I get your concept but...?

Love is good but who labels a player who is shooting 33% from 3point land "too good a shooter"?

Love is not the only shooter who gets open shots from these doubles. SO I don't know why you only single him out. Robinson brought the Heat back into the game from these open 3's im talking about.

Like I said Bam going 7/11 is not going to carry a team to a win. Giving Robinson open 3 can though.

Randle having lazy closes to shooters in scramble situations is a given. That is why you must take it into account when thinking of a defensive scheme.

Like I said before you don't have to agree. This is just what my defensive philosophy would be. Shaq you double because he will kill you. Bam you don't because he won't score enough to will a team to a win. Plus constantly being in scramble mode is bad for rebounds as we saw in that game we got destroyed on the board in. Remember that was also the problem the Cavs had with us. They would be in scramble mode trying to stop Brunson and it destroyed them.

ramtour420 @ 5/12/2023 8:45 AM
Since we are on this topic, if we decide to take away Miami's 3 ball and they start force feeding Bam we would destroy them. If Bam is shooting his little jumper from the free throws line he is out of position for rebounds. Simple as that. He is their main rebounder. Without him we win the boards and that gives us a chance. Unlike the end of game 4....
SergioNYK @ 5/12/2023 9:30 AM
ramtour420 wrote:Since we are on this topic, if we decide to take away Miami's 3 ball and they start force feeding Bam we would destroy them. If Bam is shooting his little jumper from the free throws line he is out of position for rebounds. Simple as that. He is their main rebounder. Without him we win the boards and that gives us a chance. Unlike the end of game 4....

YES! I have not understood our defensive strategy in this series with doubling Butler and allowing him to pass out and swing the ball for an open three. Miami missed a ton of open threes last game, can't expect them to miss those tonight. Let Butler cook and get his 40-60 or whatever and stay home on their shooters! Plus it's putting us in scrambling mode and that's allowing them to get all those offensive rebounds and second chance points! Thibs is respecting and fearing Butler way too much and not respecting their supporting cast enough!

foosballnick @ 5/12/2023 12:00 PM
SergioNYK wrote:
ramtour420 wrote:Since we are on this topic, if we decide to take away Miami's 3 ball and they start force feeding Bam we would destroy them. If Bam is shooting his little jumper from the free throws line he is out of position for rebounds. Simple as that. He is their main rebounder. Without him we win the boards and that gives us a chance. Unlike the end of game 4....

YES! I have not understood our defensive strategy in this series with doubling Butler and allowing him to pass out and swing the ball for an open three. Miami missed a ton of open threes last game, can't expect them to miss those tonight. Let Butler cook and get his 40-60 or whatever and stay home on their shooters! Plus it's putting us in scrambling mode and that's allowing them to get all those offensive rebounds and second chance points! Thibs is respecting and fearing Butler way too much and not respecting their supporting cast enough!

Its a numbers game and Thibs is probably playing the percentages. Bam is a career 56% shooter from 2 and Butler is at .564 for this season. To equal that from 3 - a player would have to shoot better than 37%. This season the Heat have not been good from 3 except for Herro who is hurt. While they have been on streaks in the playoffs - my best guess is that Thibs is coaching with the philosophy that even though some players such as Duncan go on streaks in a game, if you play the overall percentages, the Heat can hurt you more inside with Bam and Butler.

3 Point percentages this season and its really not pretty:

Bam Adebayo (.083)
Jimmy Butler (.350)
Kyle Lowry (.345)
Caleb Martin (.356)
Max Strus (.350)
Gabe Vincent (.334)
Kevin Love (.297) -.354 with Cleveland
Haywood Highsmith (.339)
Duncan Robinson (.328)

DJMUSIC @ 5/12/2023 5:22 PM
NYKBocker wrote:
Philc1 wrote:
Chandler wrote:
Clean wrote:
The Mitch one was not Bams fault.

Honestly this should be sent to league offices. In older days teams would do that and on top of that coaches like Riley and Jackson would talk about this and announce they were compiling the evidence to put pressure on league office

That hit on Grimes was brutal

I’m sure silver is on it

Bam Adebayo IS Modern day Charles Oakley/ Ricky Mahorn ... they beat your arrsee regardless of Caught OR not.
Rules different then however closest NYK has to mix it up with Bam Adebayo is Isaiah H. Not worth fighting
but Knicks need to have an agile body to put Bam in check a bit, to disrupt his game. Unsure? if Knicks has
that kind of player. Definitely not Mitch. Dont want Isaiah H to foul out either... Tough Bam matchup vs. Knicks

Hate to say it. Gonna have to put a bounty on that motherfucker.

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