Knicks · Kolek has no bag (page 1)

he can dribble anywhere he wants... he's got a great handle, but he's got zero bag. You do not need to guard him and he can't defend anyone. He went to the Frank Ntilikina school of scoring. This is why IQ got minutes as rookie and Tyler sits.

He's 24.

Lets spend the day talking about how Thibs has let him rotting on the bench while overplaying the starters.

Go

fishmike wrote:he can dribble anywhere he wants... he's got a great handle, but he's got zero bag. You do not need to guard him and he can't defend anyone. He went to the Frank Ntilikina school of scoring. This is why IQ got minutes as rookie and Tyler sits.

He's 24.

Lets spend the day talking about how Thibs has let him rotting on the bench while overplaying the starters.

Go

I mean, you are right. Outside of manage the offense, orchestrate and make passes creating easy buckets for his team mates, he doesn’t do much.

franco12 wrote:

fishmike wrote:he can dribble anywhere he wants... he's got a great handle, but he's got zero bag. You do not need to guard him and he can't defend anyone. He went to the Frank Ntilikina school of scoring. This is why IQ got minutes as rookie and Tyler sits.

He's 24.

Lets spend the day talking about how Thibs has let him rotting on the bench while overplaying the starters.

Go

I mean, you are right. Outside of manage the offense, orchestrate and make passes creating easy buckets for his team mates, he doesn’t do much.

Yep, allowing teammates to get hot ( Bridges last game) is definitely overrated. Against the Mavs he got a block..., 17 assists to zero turnovers, meh big deal, right?

franco12 wrote:

fishmike wrote:he can dribble anywhere he wants... he's got a great handle, but he's got zero bag. You do not need to guard him and he can't defend anyone. He went to the Frank Ntilikina school of scoring. This is why IQ got minutes as rookie and Tyler sits.

He's 24.

Lets spend the day talking about how Thibs has let him rotting on the bench while overplaying the starters.

Go

I mean, you are right. Outside of manage the offense, orchestrate and make passes creating easy buckets for his team mates, he doesn’t do much.

the minus 1 in the box score confirms that

PArdon me as I will repeat what I just posted on the game thread. "No Bag" might be harsh, but he does need to start bringing a duffle with him to keep people honest.

What Kolek is gonna need to add as he gets more minutes is more of a threat of scoring. He is a gifted passer with elite court vision and runs around the court like he's John Stockton. But teams will overplay his tendencies and he will have to be able to go the basket and finish and also hit an occasional pull up 3 when given space. Nothing that has to happen this year, unless you really feel like we need to give him 15-20 mins of game from now through the playoffs (I don't think we will be doing that).
He had a couple nice finishes, but he's also been blocked more than a few times the last 2 games and hasn't been able to stick his 3s (though the preseason showed and he can stick them - so with work I believe he will). Personally I think last night what I was most impressed with was his defensive positioning and intensity. He is small and not super fast, so will always be limited, but he was in the right place and in people's faces, and did a great job on help and rotating a few times.

What my goal is for him is that he used the opportunity he has right now to earn the backup PG spot next year. Payne is on a 1 yr 3mm deal and Deuce is a wing. Kolek backing up Brunson would save us a lot on roster construction/salary and he absolutely is showing enough signs to earn that for next year. And for a 2nd round pick that is a massive win.

If Deuce is out for longer and Kolek shows the little bit of scoring between now and the end of the year, than I'm open to the case of him playing - but probably over Shamet and not Payne. And then Thibs is going to have to come to terms with going small. But our best players on the bench are Robinson, Deuce, Payne and then Kolek. 3 of those guys are PG size and one of them is a 5. Its not the ideal mix.

Also - it is totally OK to be excited about the potential of someone who gets 17 assists vs no turnovers in < 40 mins of play, even if he only got 2 buckets during that time. There's NBA skill there.

VDesai wrote:PArdon me as I will repeat what I just posted on the game thread. "No Bag" might be harsh, but he does need to start bringing a duffle with him to keep people honest.

What Kolek is gonna need to add as he gets more minutes is more of a threat of scoring. He is a gifted passer with elite court vision and runs around the court like he's John Stockton. But teams will overplay his tendencies and he will have to be able to go the basket and finish and also hit an occasional pull up 3 when given space. Nothing that has to happen this year, unless you really feel like we need to give him 15-20 mins of game from now through the playoffs (I don't think we will be doing that).
He had a couple nice finishes, but he's also been blocked more than a few times the last 2 games and hasn't been able to stick his 3s (though the preseason showed and he can stick them - so with work I believe he will). Personally I think last night what I was most impressed with was his defensive positioning and intensity. He is small and not super fast, so will always be limited, but he was in the right place and in people's faces, and did a great job on help and rotating a few times.

What my goal is for him is that he used the opportunity he has right now to earn the backup PG spot next year. Payne is on a 1 yr 3mm deal and Deuce is a wing. Kolek backing up Brunson would save us a lot on roster construction/salary and he absolutely is showing enough signs to earn that for next year. And for a 2nd round pick that is a massive win.

If Deuce is out for longer and Kolek shows the little bit of scoring between now and the end of the year, than I'm open to the case of him playing - but probably over Shamet and not Payne. And then Thibs is going to have to come to terms with going small. But our best players on the bench are Robinson, Deuce, Payne and then Kolek. 3 of those guys are PG size and one of them is a 5. Its not the ideal mix.

good post. Finally an ounce of realism. I really hope the bold is right. I do not see it because he's not aggressive offensively and seems to know any challenge to his shot is enough to make him balk.

VDesai wrote:Also - it is totally OK to be excited about the potential of someone who gets 17 assists vs no turnovers in < 40 mins of play, even if he only got 2 buckets during that time. There's NBA skill there.

3-4 years ago we are happy about seeing NBA skill there. Now we are looking for a backup PG who can give us quality minutes in the post season and help us compete for a title.

The goalposts have changed. When I see a defensive liability and player who cant create a shot at 24 I am thinking this is not the guy. The kid from the JHawks looks much more like an NBA player.

Its a big roster hole right now if we want to contend... it would be amazing to get a cheap buyout guy like Marcus Smart.

fishmike wrote:he can dribble anywhere he wants... he's got a great handle, but he's got zero bag. You do not need to guard him and he can't defend anyone. He went to the Frank Ntilikina school of scoring. This is why IQ got minutes as rookie and Tyler sits.

He's 24.

Lets spend the day talking about how Thibs has let him rotting on the bench while overplaying the starters.

Go

Kolek is a rook and doesn't want to step on anyone's toes by being aggressive scoring imo. Plus it's not his role! I think it's too early to call him a Ntilikina on offense.

SergioNYK wrote:

fishmike wrote:he can dribble anywhere he wants... he's got a great handle, but he's got zero bag. You do not need to guard him and he can't defend anyone. He went to the Frank Ntilikina school of scoring. This is why IQ got minutes as rookie and Tyler sits.

He's 24.

Lets spend the day talking about how Thibs has let him rotting on the bench while overplaying the starters.

Go

Kolek is a rook and doesn't want to step on anyone's toes by being aggressive scoring imo. Plus it's not his role! I think it's too early to call him a Ntilikina on offense.

Its ridiculous to compare him to Frank. Frank wasnt the playmaker that Kolek is. His defense is improving. Is much more willing to defend with his body, instead of his hands. Taking contact, steals.

As far as scoring. Who on this team is a better playmaker? Not Brunson, not consistently. Looks for his own shot too much at times.

Kolek has shown that he can score off the dribble. But he's leaning on his best attribute, passing. Frank wasnt as good at getting to the rim or passing. And he was averaging 20 minutes a game as a rook. Kolek is doing more, with a lot less PT.

Frank? GTFO

Next season could be Jokubaitis’s time.

Rookie wrote:Next season could be Jokubaitis’s time.

Thought we were done with him.

Fishmike, you must be joking. Kolek is the truth. Give this kid 30 minutes and he probably leads the league in assists in 2-3 years. Yeah his defense probably will never be more than adequate due to his size, but I see no reason this kid cannot be a 17-18 pt scorer with 10 dimes a night in 2-3 years (other than JB limiting his playing time). Right now he is just trying to fit in with the vets, but this kid will be able to score efficiently. He was definitely the steal of the draft. I think they let Payne walk this summer and let Kolek get those minutes next year.

Like, a dime bag?

Rookie wrote:Next season could be Jokubaitis’s time.

he's got good size

fishmike wrote:

franco12 wrote:

fishmike wrote:he can dribble anywhere he wants... he's got a great handle, but he's got zero bag. You do not need to guard him and he can't defend anyone. He went to the Frank Ntilikina school of scoring. This is why IQ got minutes as rookie and Tyler sits.

He's 24.

Lets spend the day talking about how Thibs has let him rotting on the bench while overplaying the starters.

Go

I mean, you are right. Outside of manage the offense, orchestrate and make passes creating easy buckets for his team mates, he doesn’t do much.

the minus 1 in the box score confirms that

I'm not dying on the Kolek hill, one way or the other,but -1 in such a small sample size isn't worth mentioning. Even if you did take that number seriously, all it suggests is that his impact on the court is pretty much neutral.

BigDaddyG wrote:

fishmike wrote:

franco12 wrote:

fishmike wrote:he can dribble anywhere he wants... he's got a great handle, but he's got zero bag. You do not need to guard him and he can't defend anyone. He went to the Frank Ntilikina school of scoring. This is why IQ got minutes as rookie and Tyler sits.

He's 24.

Lets spend the day talking about how Thibs has let him rotting on the bench while overplaying the starters.

Go

I mean, you are right. Outside of manage the offense, orchestrate and make passes creating easy buckets for his team mates, he doesn’t do much.

the minus 1 in the box score confirms that

I'm not dying on the Kolek hill, one way or the other,but -1 in such a small sample size isn't worth mentioning. Even if you did take that number seriously, all it suggests is that his impact on the court is pretty much neutral.

Good take. Kolek is John Stocton? Maybe one day, but not close.
Does not want to step on anyones shoes? He likely doing what his coaches are asking him.
Small sample is not conclusive nor has he racked up minutes against quality opponents. Yet.
That he is getting run is Thibs showing confidence in his game. Notion "Thibs is holding him back" might ask ones self "Why?"
If the kid is ready, I think Thib and Co. would have a better sense than us.
If he does start to get his bag and contribute its not "See I told you", its "Thibs got it right". There is no benefit to him or other yoots playing badly.
"How will they learn?"
This is not rec ball, these are paid professionals and this is a good team. outplay the man infront and you get it done. Not easy mid season until an injury occurs.
Thats the nature of the game. Its a tough business.

Kolek has to hit his shots. Maybe his coaches want him doing a few things well before they put more tools in his bag.

BigDaddyG wrote:

fishmike wrote:

franco12 wrote:

fishmike wrote:he can dribble anywhere he wants... he's got a great handle, but he's got zero bag. You do not need to guard him and he can't defend anyone. He went to the Frank Ntilikina school of scoring. This is why IQ got minutes as rookie and Tyler sits.

He's 24.

Lets spend the day talking about how Thibs has let him rotting on the bench while overplaying the starters.

Go

I mean, you are right. Outside of manage the offense, orchestrate and make passes creating easy buckets for his team mates, he doesn’t do much.

the minus 1 in the box score confirms that

I'm not dying on the Kolek hill, one way or the other,but -1 in such a small sample size isn't worth mentioning. Even if you did take that number seriously, all it suggests is that his impact on the court is pretty much neutral.

of course.. it was meant to be as silly as Franco's take but pretty sure he takes that seriously. Who knows.

I was really put off by his fear of scoring. It was in the Ben Simmons zone. So I go on the interwebs to see if anyone else is thinking Meh and this isnt a good fit. Clearly Im wrong as he's Stockton like in his ability to run an offense, has been rotting on the bench, could be a Jeremy Lin if the coaches gave him burn. Its def me!

fishmike wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:

fishmike wrote:

franco12 wrote:

fishmike wrote:he can dribble anywhere he wants... he's got a great handle, but he's got zero bag. You do not need to guard him and he can't defend anyone. He went to the Frank Ntilikina school of scoring. This is why IQ got minutes as rookie and Tyler sits.

He's 24.

Lets spend the day talking about how Thibs has let him rotting on the bench while overplaying the starters.

Go

I mean, you are right. Outside of manage the offense, orchestrate and make passes creating easy buckets for his team mates, he doesn’t do much.

the minus 1 in the box score confirms that

I'm not dying on the Kolek hill, one way or the other,but -1 in such a small sample size isn't worth mentioning. Even if you did take that number seriously, all it suggests is that his impact on the court is pretty much neutral.

of course.. it was meant to be as silly as Franco's take but pretty sure he takes that seriously. Who knows.

I was really put off by his fear of scoring. It was in the Ben Simmons zone. So I go on the interwebs to see if anyone else is thinking Meh and this isnt a good fit. Clearly Im wrong as he's Stockton like in his ability to run an offense, has been rotting on the bench, could be a Jeremy Lin if the coaches gave him burn. Its def me!

"fear of scoring"
I don't see that. He's just not scoring yet, at the NBA level yet.

Come on fish, you've been around long enough to know knick fans are the only fans in the NBA, who loves the 15th man. Now it's "P J TUCKER"

Kolek will be a great Payne replacement next year, for the cheap. He will have his "dime bag" in a "duffle bag" all next season. Right now, it's just "puff puff pass"

newyorknewyork wrote:

lol 100%