I see where you guys are coming from here - most of you are saying basically just throwing money at FAs isn't necessarily the answer - and I agree to a certain extent. Listen, we've gotten burned here before so that argument's definitely a valid one. But to me if we had the options in house or on the farm to fix some of these problems I'd feel more comfortable passing on some of the talent-for-hire out there. Problem is we don't have that. Where's our replacement for Bobby Abreu on the farm? Where's our next first baseman? Our next second baseman if we deal Cano? And a little further down the road, where's our replacement for Jeter in a few seasons? Even our pitching - Joba's obviously the real deal regardless of how we eventually wind up using him but where's our replacements for Mussina and Pettitte - Hughes and Kennedy aren't ready for that, not yet anyway. See what I'm saying - where's our Kevin Youkilis, Dustin Pedroia and Jon Lester??
Hey to our credit, I understand that we've developed plenty of talent up to this point that's still here and still serving us well - Jeter, Posada, Mariano, Cano, Wang, Chamberlain - and sometimes both the Yankee hater and Yankee fan forgets that. It's just that the next wave of young impact players, especially everyday position players, from within the organization just isn't there right now. Lately we've focused so much on collecting young arms in the minors (which isn't a bad idea btw - you can never stockpile enough pitching - it would just be nice to start seeing a little return on some of these young pitchers beside Joba already) but I think it's come at the expense of drafting offensive position players/guys with power. We might have one legit power guy in Jesus Montero but we're at least 2 or 3 years away from finding out. Our top minor league teams are basically devoid of legit major league positon talent and that concerns me. My point is this: if we went out and got the pitching we need but neglect to improve the offense, we're no better as a team than we are right now at this moment. I mean what would the point be of going out and throwing millions at a CC Sabathia, AJ Burnett and/or making a blockbuster trade for a Jake Peavy if we're not also prepared to improve the offense at the same time? Quite a few teams out there with very good pitching for a few season now (Toronto comes to mind) but not the type of offense they need to really compete with the top clubs and they've suffered. A team like Toronto has stayed in the middle of the pack in our division for a while now and it's not because of their pitching. It's got to be an even balance - pitching, offense and defense - and when you don't have the options coming from within, sometimes you gotta look elsewhere if you're an organization that serious about winning...
The only FA bat I really want is Mark Teixeria anyway. He's the real difference maker for us. The rest I'm willing to re-adjust from within. We add at least 2 very good starting pitchers and Mark Teixeria and I think we have enough left over from within to make this work. And that's provided we make the right choice and bring back Abreu - here's a guy that has really lengthened the lineup & put up very good numbers for us since we traded for him. If they let him walk they'll be scrambling trying to fill his shoes and that'll wind up being a problem IMHO. Even with Nady having a year close to last season, w/o Abreu or someone else that can give you Abreu's numbers and presence, they'll suffer. Mark my words. They've gotta ask themselves, are we going all in here or not? Because if you only go 75 or even 90% in it may not be enough. Bring back Abreu...
Posted by nyk4ever:
I have no problem standing pat this year, even it means another year without the playoffs next year. I just don't really like many of the options out there for us, they all have some serious question marks about them, which for me is enough to stay away. Let's make some smart trades this offseason and see where it takes us for next year. If we don't make the playoffs, then we don't, but I honestly think that's better than signing half the league and hoping they come together.
i don't think that's really a feasible option w/the new stadium going up & everyone expecting big changes after last season... the Yanks are gonna be signing up guys regardless, even if they can't get the CC's or the Mark T's to come here, u can bet on that much... i don't think missing out on the playoffs is an option for Cashman & the Steinbrenners in their minds either... i hear what u're saying & i don't wanna repeat the same mistakes we made the past few years either... just putting together a haphazard buncha guys is not gonna bring us any championships... we gotta think about how these guys fit together... team chemistry is such an underrated concept amongst most fans but if u look at most teams that win the WS, they have awesome team chemistry & complement one another real well... we need to build a TEAM first before we can start thinking about winning championships again.
I'm personally not interested in giving up a ton to get Peavy, but I think if Manny is willing to take 3 years or less, he'd be a no brainer. He'd take an amazing amount of pressure off A-Rod and get him much better pitches to hit by protecting him in the lineup. I think we'd get a potentially massive offensive boost.
i'd go as high as $70 mil over 3 years for Manny... anything more than that i'd pass... i don't see a ton of teams out there that will give him much more than that over a longer term.
The New York Post reports that "the Yankees have inquired about the availability of Mike Cameron and the Brewers are weighing whether to deal the center fielder."
Milwaukee recently picked up Cameron's $10 million option for 2009, but may still deal him and have reportedly "been asking around about Melky Cabrera." The newspaper speculates that the Yankees may offer up Cabrera, Wilson Betemit and "a pitcher" for Cameron.
I don't like this idea... by the start of the year Cameron will be 36 and he's a guy that is ALWAYS injured. While his bat and glove are good, you can't rely on him. I know he'd only be a stopgap, but I don't know, if we are dealing for a CFer, I want it to be McClouth.
i swear if Cashman signs Cameron i'm gonna be doing a Bonn impersonation on this thread... the guy should not be a Yankee... he strikes out more than half our roster all by himself.
WHY THE HELL ARE THEY CONSIDERING SIGNING
CAMERON!!!
This guys a fuck'n idiot at the plate! He strikes out like no one's business!!! He isn't a legit threat at the plate.
I don't mind letting Giambi and Pavano go, not at all. They should be looking for one legit slugger and two more starting pitchers! I don't get it.
Their talking about possibly trading Hediki away also? They need to step back and think about bringing as many of these guys over to the new stadium as they can, with the exception of those three positions I mentioned.
For a second, I thought it was isiah making these calls. Fuck!
i agree... i'd much rather just go w/a weak hitting Gardner in CF all year than see them spend money to bring Cameron here.
Moose just won his 7th GG... Congrats to him... he's always been 1 of the best fielding pitchers in the game... i think if Mariano was a starting pitcher he'd have his fair share as well... other than those 2 guys i don't remember a better fielding pitcher since Gator... now that guy was an athlete if i ever saw one.
What about Greg Maddux? He's pretty much the best fielding pitcher of all time. He just won his 18th gold glove...
Posted by TMS:
Moose just won his 7th GG... Congrats to him... he's always been 1 of the best fielding pitchers in the game... i think if Mariano was a starting pitcher he'd have his fair share as well... other than those 2 guys i don't remember a better fielding pitcher since Gator... now that guy was an athlete if i ever saw one.
If you didn't finish it with Gator, I sure would have. The old #49 x 2 = 4949!
Posted by VDesai:
What about Greg Maddux? He's pretty much the best fielding pitcher of all time. He just won his 18th gold glove...
good point, forgot about him.
Jim Kaat was another... 14 straight GG awards... that's pretty sick.
btw, getting back to the Mark T subject, we at least have a promising young prospect in the minors named Jesus Montero that might be ready in a couple years to take over fulltime if we can't land Mark T this offseason... i know he's being groomed as a C/DH but i'm sure they'll be trying him out at 1B soon enough... he's coming off a great season in A ball w/a .326 BA / 17 HR / 87 RBI... i gotta believe if we do land Mark T then he's gonna be part of any trade offers we make to the Pads for Jake Peavy.
[Edited by - TMS on 11-06-2008 9:45 PM]
Posted by VDesai:
What about Greg Maddux? He's pretty much the best fielding pitcher of all time. He just won his 18th gold glove...
You mean that guy who used to keep the ball real low, throwing a lot of change-ups, throwing off hitters and causing them to hit duds right back to him? That guy?
Gator was a cat! Could springs from the mound and fire to first, like he fired it to the plate. Great athlete.
Maddux is a Duracell Battery, who's played for 22 years now.
Posted by TMS:
Jim Kaat was another... 14 straight GG awards... that's pretty sick.
I met a ton of these guys back in the late 70's and through the 80's. Jim was a good guy to. Built like a rodeo rider.
looks like Peavy might be out of the question... sounds like he's gonna be dealt to the Braves or the Cubbies:
http://www.prosportsdaily.com/comments/n... New York Yankees can rule out Jake Peavy , columnist says
0 Comment
November 7
Newark Star-Ledger
"When NJ.com posted news of Jake Peavy adding the New York Yankees to his trade list, fans and commentors called it a long shot. Today's New York Post suggests Peavy won't see pinstripes in 2009. According to Joel Sherman, San Diego Padres' GM Kevin Towers has set the wheels in motion for a trade to either the Atlanta Braves or Chicago Cubs, two of Peavy's top choices for next season. There is even a chance that Peavy will be dealt before the winter meetings in early December:Towers spoke to Peavy's agent, Barry Axelrod, on Wednesday night to inform him of the progress and to ask Axelrod to get assurance from Peavy that it was OK to finalize a trade to one of these teams. Towers said, "We got the thumbs up."If that's not enough to convince you that Peavy has no interest in the Yankees, then Sherman is sure to clear that up:Despite reports to the contrary, the Yanks are not in the Peavy market. He has a no-trade clause and does not want to pitch in the AL."
Posted by TMS:
looks like Peavy might be out of the question... sounds like he's gonna be dealt to the Braves or the Cubbies:
http://www.prosportsdaily.com/comments/n...
New York Yankees can rule out Jake Peavy , columnist says
0 Comment
November 7
Newark Star-Ledger
"When NJ.com posted news of Jake Peavy adding the New York Yankees to his trade list, fans and commentors called it a long shot. Today's New York Post suggests Peavy won't see pinstripes in 2009. According to Joel Sherman, San Diego Padres' GM Kevin Towers has set the wheels in motion for a trade to either the Atlanta Braves or Chicago Cubs, two of Peavy's top choices for next season. There is even a chance that Peavy will be dealt before the winter meetings in early December:Towers spoke to Peavy's agent, Barry Axelrod, on Wednesday night to inform him of the progress and to ask Axelrod to get assurance from Peavy that it was OK to finalize a trade to one of these teams. Towers said, "We got the thumbs up."If that's not enough to convince you that Peavy has no interest in the Yankees, then Sherman is sure to clear that up:Despite reports to the contrary, the Yanks are not in the Peavy market. He has a no-trade clause and does not want to pitch in the AL."
I saw this too. A shame. We still might not be totally out of it though. Trade talks break down all the time. Until Cash comes out and says it's completely dead or he actually gets traded then I'll turn the page. Until then...... Towers supposedly really likes our prospects from what I read. He's probably just asking for the moon & the Yankees drew the line on him at some point. We'll be finding out soon I guess. Have a feeling it's not 100% dead yet - not until the fat lady sings....
[Edited by - finestrg on 11-08-2008 05:39 AM]
i think we should focus our attention on other young stud arms like Zack Greinke or Chad Billingsley... dunno if their teams are looking to deal them but doesn't look like Peavy's in the cards for us right now... of course if trade talks do break down like u said we could be back in the game but i'd be perfectly happy w/a kid like Greinke if we could land him in a trade too.
here's a curveball from outta the blue... ESPN Insider says the Brewers are willing to hear offers for Prince Fielder... i find that hard to believe but let's just say that out of the Cameron trade discussions, Cashman just happens to inquire about what it might take to land Prince Fielder instead? he's due a huge payday pretty soon & the Brewers won't be able to pay him what he's gonna be looking to eventually get... the Yankees on the other hand, can pay him what he wants, & he's got his father's legacy in NY to make the transition easier... we could use his huge bat at 1B to replace Giambi's offense & w/his lefty swing he'd easily hit 45+ HR's at the Stadium.
let's say we offer up Cano, Jackson & Hughes for Fielder & we take Cameron's big money contract off the Brewers' hands for them as a condition of the deal, do u think it would get it done?
if we're successful in signing CC along w/either Moose or Andy P & another starter like AJB, Lowe, Garland or Perez, i think we'd upgrade the team tremendously both offensively & pitching-wise... playing Gardner more in CF would upgrade us defensively as well... Fielder's not a great defensive 1B so if we sign up a 2B w/range like Orlando Hudson to replace Cano, he can help make up for some of Fielder's lack of range.
what about this team:
1 - Damon LF
2 - Jeter SS
3 - ARod 3B
4 - Fielder 1B
5 - Matsui DH
6 - Nady RF
7 - Jorge C
8 - Hudson 2B
9 - Gardner/Cameron CF
rotation:
Sabathia
AJB, Perez, Garland or Lowe
Joba
Moose or Pettitte
Aceves
[Edited by - TMS on 11-08-2008 5:29 PM]
Posted by Finestrg:
Posted by TMS:
looks like Peavy might be out of the question... sounds like he's gonna be dealt to the Braves or the Cubbies:
http://www.prosportsdaily.com/comments/n...
New York Yankees can rule out Jake Peavy , columnist says
0 Comment
November 7
Newark Star-Ledger
"When NJ.com posted news of Jake Peavy adding the New York Yankees to his trade list, fans and commentors called it a long shot. Today's New York Post suggests Peavy won't see pinstripes in 2009. According to Joel Sherman, San Diego Padres' GM Kevin Towers has set the wheels in motion for a trade to either the Atlanta Braves or Chicago Cubs, two of Peavy's top choices for next season. There is even a chance that Peavy will be dealt before the winter meetings in early December:Towers spoke to Peavy's agent, Barry Axelrod, on Wednesday night to inform him of the progress and to ask Axelrod to get assurance from Peavy that it was OK to finalize a trade to one of these teams. Towers said, "We got the thumbs up."If that's not enough to convince you that Peavy has no interest in the Yankees, then Sherman is sure to clear that up:Despite reports to the contrary, the Yanks are not in the Peavy market. He has a no-trade clause and does not want to pitch in the AL."
I saw this too. A shame. We still might not be totally out of it though. Trade talks break down all the time. Until Cash comes out and says it's completely dead or he actually gets traded then I'll turn the page. Until then...... Towers supposedly really likes our prospects from what I read. He's probably just asking for the moon & the Yankees drew the line on him at some point. We'll be finding out soon I guess. Have a feeling it's not 100% dead yet - not until the fat lady sings....
[Edited by - finestrg on 11-08-2008 05:39 AM]
I hope he goes to Atlanta if that's the way he feels and not' chicago. I want the longest losing record to continue.
